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Study: Male supporters of Trump have fragile masculinity

 
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Skyweir
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 10:35 am    Post subject: Study: Male supporters of Trump have fragile masculinity Reply with quote

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www.newsweek.com/trump-appeals-men-fragile-masculinity-1236701%3famp=1

This is an intriguing read wasn't sure whether it belongs here, or the Tank or somewhere else entirely. Why? Mainly because its a study of the human psyche

Quote:
President Donald Trump appeals to men with fragile masculinity, two researchers from New York University wrote in analysis published in The Washington Post. They also said Republican candidates facing a Democrat drew more support in areas with higher levels of fragile masculinity in 2018 House races.

The president has touted his masculinity since declaring he would run for office. After Marco Rubio insinuated the president had a small penis in 2016, Trump raised his hands and said "he referred to my hands -- 'if they're small, something else must be small.' I guarantee you there's no problem. I guarantee."

He frequently calls other political figures weak and has promoted his bravery, saying after the Parkland school shooting that "I really believe I'd run in there even if I didn't have a weapon." He espouses visions of toughness, like cheering hard football hits, and promotes shows of strength, like his proposed military parade.
NYU Psychology professor Eric Knowles and doctoral student Sarah DiMuccio queried 300 men on Amazon's crowdsourcing platform Mechanical Turk to discover whether they had or would search for terms such as "erectile dysfunction," "how to get girls," "penis enlargement," "testosterone," and "Viagra," among others.

They discovered a high level of concern about masculinity "was strongly associated with interest in these search topics."

They then correlated the geopgrahic dispersion of these search topics in 2016 with how such areas voted in that year's election, finding "that support for Trump in the 2016 election was higher in areas that had more searches for topics such as 'erectile dysfunction.' Moreover, this relationship persisted after accounting for demographic attributes in media markets, such as education levels and racial composition, as well as searches for topics unrelated to fragile masculinity, such as 'breast augmentation' and 'menopause.'


Im sure its not imperical in its evidence, and there will always be exceptions to the rule, but interesting, no? Thoughts?
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let me get this straight ... a student and his teacher asked 300 guys if they had, or would, search for topics that might appeal to just about ANY man ("how to get girls"), and then they correlated this to geographical regions that went for Trump--without actually determining if those men were in fact Trump voters, and then claimed that this interest in male topics represents "fragile" masculinity, and therefore (drum roll . . . ) Trump voters have fragile masculinity!

This is the dumbest shit I've seen in a while. Come on, Sky.

Having a medical issue that affects guys doesn't mean one's masculinity is fragile. Being interested in getting girls doesn't mean one's masculinity is fragile. Just because one of those 300 guys may have lived in my state and my state voted for Trump doesn't imply ANYTHING about Trump voters in general.

Dumb. Dumb. DUMB. It pisses me off how stupid this is and that anyone would find it interesting. This is what fake news looks like. This is why it's so painfully obvious that our universities are institutions of liberal brainwashing. Just imagine for a moment if a study had been conducted that showed that Hillary voters are ugly, bitter dried up women who can't get guys to have sex with them. Do you think that study would have ever been given the greenlight to proceed? Do you think Newsweek would have published the results?

Aside from being dumb pseudo science, this is over the top sexist and offensive liberal propaganda.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 5:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Study: Male supporters of Trump have fragile masculinity Reply with quote

Skyweir wrote:
Thoughts?

I think I'm hoping you didn't just turn Fist's Close 'Tank-like.

As they themselves pointed out, cause is tricky.
But complaining about "it's just correlation" as if it means nothing is a dumb point brought up as insightful/definitive far too often.

My own guestimate is that:
of people who talk like Trump and/or respect that attitude/approach as "manly"

or follow the "real men" thought-base

at least 3/4 are fragile/fake.

[[Really, it could be 1/2, but I suspect it's likely 9/10 or more]]

The interesting thing to me...because it relates to a couple things I'm tracking/thinking about [concerning character creation/believability]...is that it isn't "global" [it didn't affect support for female candidates in 2018?] and it seems like the kind of trait that WOULD be....seems like the kind of thing that would affect---not necessarily determine, but skew one direction in a statistically noticeable way---all ones political choices in the current political structure, the party platforms/positions and divisions.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 01, 2018 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I did wonder where this was best placed. I can delete and move if you wish .. unless Fist is the only one that can, so be it.

Though in my defence, it's a study of human behaviour and human psyche .. yes with a focus on masculinity... and as such raises some very interesting observations. The only "political aspect, is the its alleged voting relationship to the subject of interest .. which is the correlation of the human psyche, personality traits, and identified prevalences ... and a postulating of what that might mean in and of itself, and what that indicates about a class of people that have those similar variables in common.

Z, I noted in the introduction that it doesnt smack of imperical evidence .. but thought it very interesting as an article. But this is not a stand alone perspective, there is quite a body of opinion and research on this very common subject matter postulation.

And here are a few links to others...

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/2378023117749380
This is simply the abstract, but makes some rather interesting observations that add weight to the line of though explored by the above mentioned study.

Quote:
Given that the president is thought to be the national representative, presidential campaigns often reflect the efforts to define a national identity and collective values. Political humor provides a unique lens through which to explore how identity figures into national politics given that the critique of an intended target is often made through popular cultural scripts that often inadvertently reify the very power structures they seek to subvert.

In conducting an analysis of 240 tweets, memes, and political cartoons from the 2016 U.S. presidential election targeting the two frontrunners, Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump, we see how popular political humor often reaffirmed heteronormative assumptions of gender, sexuality, and race and equated scripts of hegemonic masculinity with presidential ability

In doing so, these discourses reified a patriarchal power structure.


The actual report is here
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/pdf/10.1177/2378023117749380
Which I think you V will find very interesting.

What rape culture says about masculinity
https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/theconversation.com/amp/what-rape-culture-says-about-masculinity-85513

This article critiques the use of terms like "toxic masculinity" giving arguably a more balanced perspective. I think it bears noting that it is not a term intended to tar all men with this particular toxicity .. but its the culture and socialisation of male toxicity, and the harm toxic expectations have on men's own health as well as the health and wellbeing of those around them. There is arguably also an equivalent "toxic femininity" .. but you can read here if interested.
https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2017-01-28/toxic-masculinity-war-could-backfire/8207704

That article is a feminist perspective.. some of you may wish to disregard it without a glance, on that basis but I see again, common themes here. Its the psychology of the alleged weak masculinity concept and the toxic masculinity concept that is interesting, is it not?

Here's an article about a 2017 study along similar lines .. this is a brilliant overview and identifies 5 key traits .. I find this one compelling.
https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www.psychologytoday.com/au/blog/mind-in-the-machine/201712/analysis-trump-supporters-has-identified-5-key-traits%3famp

Quote:
This article analyzes the 2016 presidential campaign of Donald Trump, arguing that the rhetorical form of his appeals constitutes demagoguery defined by a reliance on victimized, White, toxic masculinity. Extending work on demagoguery, which has emphasized its characteristic lionization of certainty and demands for mastery, I suggest that Trump's capacity to conclude his audience as at risk and vulnerable figures a condition inherent to democratic politics-undecidability-as a threat to personhood. Trump's construction of a precarious and socially segregated "America" constitutes an image of masculinist totality that works on the basis of the incompleteness suffusing politics while undermining the possibilities for a feminist political ethics characterized by mutual vulnerability.


https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2017/feb/27/michael-kimmel-masculinity-far-right-angry-white-men

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www.theatlantic.com/amp/article/558674/

https://www.google.com.au/amp/s/www.theatlantic.com/amp/article/558674/

I can appreciate that as a Trump supporter, this may be a sensitive issue, and you couldnt be faulted for feeling this information confrontational. If its possible try not to take the data personally.. every reasonable human knows, its irrational to tar all humans with the one brush. I said as much in the Tank recently, when someone posed a very similar scenario to me.

Remembering its not an attack of Trump supporters as much as an exploration of the human psyche, which is a key distinction.
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