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Triock and Crossed Lightning
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lazy Luke wrote:
Savor Dam wrote:
Actually, the lightning motif worn by Triock is a family crest, like the pattern of white flowers on the garments of Lena, Trell and Atiaran. He has this on his clothes even when we first meet him in LFB, when he is a simple cowherd, before his training at Revelwood.

And yet, IIRC, they were the only ones with specially designed epaulettes.

Except for Lena, Atiaran, and Trell ...

In The Illearth War was wrote:
She had her mother's hair, her mother's figure. Behind her discipline, her face was much like her mother's. And she wore the same white leaf-pattern woven into the cloth at her shoulders which Lena had worn - the pattern of Trell's and Atiaran's family.

Oh - and Elena.

Also, they are only the only ones mentioned.

Once again, we must notice the color of the leaf pattern. White. And the other: Lightning. White + Lightning = Wild Magic.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

+JMJ+

wayfriend wrote:
[...]

In The Illearth War was wrote:
She had her mother's hair, her mother's figure. Behind her discipline, her face was much like her mother's. And she wore the same white leaf-pattern woven into the cloth at her shoulders which Lena had worn - the pattern of Trell's and Atiaran's family.

Oh - and Elena.

Also, they are only the only ones mentioned.

Once again, we must notice the color of the leaf pattern. White. And the other: Lightning. White + Lightning = Wild Magic.


Hmmm ...

  1. Starting Equation: "White + Elena"

  2. The Bane of White is Green. The vicious green of the Illearth Stone could certainly be characterized as "mean". This proves that Mean naturally flows from Green.

  3. From here, it's a small step to note that Audrey II was both Mean and Green. A Mean, Green Mother. And this last, maternal indice leads us to check against the female members of Little Shop's original Off-Broadway Cast. Here, we find another green ... Ellen Greene.

    1. The fortuitous fact that Audrey II has "leaves" -- evoking Elena's "leaf-pattern woven into the cloth at her shoulders" -- adds only further scaffolding to our analysis.


  4. At first blush, "Ellen" seems suspiciously cognate to "Elena". This simply can't be a coincidence, and so we carefully place "Ellen" in reserve.

  5. Now, it should be noted that Green is always spectrally associated with the purity of White (though in a hidden, subsumed manner). And so, in order to appropriately reflect this subsumption, we shorten "Green" to its inchoate form. This yields us "G".

  6. This "G", in its abbreviated existence sublated to -- and thus contained within -- White, reintroduces White into the discussion through the backdoor. This gives us "G. White".

  7. Carrying over "Ellen" (kept safe & sound in the queue) from step 4, gives us a mature equation of "'Ellen' + 'G. White'".

  8. Ellen G. White ... of The Seventh-Day Adventist Church.


🤔 ... 💡

SRD, you sly dog you. Wink
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hail
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It was all right there!
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2019 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Savor Dam wrote:
wayfriend wrote:
Without Troy, Elena could not have failed.

Why is Troy so pivotal to Elena's failure? I see Elena more of contributor to Troy's (near-)failure than Troy being a prime cause of Elena's major error...but I don't always see the subtexts as clearly as some.


There's some wonderful subtext at Warrenbridge, when the company of the quest begin to fade out until only Covenant's ring and the Bloodguard remain.
If a definitive word were to exist at the very centre of the Word of Warning, for me it would have to be 'solider'.
Like the old begger's staff. as if the wood were harder than cement

Troy and Elena are an epic love story. And like the Bloodguard, Troy would have to endure until the very end.
But only when you believe in such a thing ...
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What interests me is the use of the word 'solider', twice. Once to describe a differance between Prothal and Mhoram, and then
to double-check the relationship between Tuvor and the bridge.

But don't take my word for it:

Quote:
14

The Council Of Lords

He touched the hard, hidden metal of his ring to steady himself,
then levered his reluctant bones erect. Glaring at the doorway as if
it were a threshold into peril, he lumbered through it and started
down the corridor. At Bannor's commanding back, he moved out of
the tower, across the courtyard, then inward and down through the
ravelled and curiously wrought passages of Revelstone.


This curious passage is key to understanding the Second Ward. And in doing so will lead to the location of the Third -
the buttressed coign on the other side of the courtyard ...
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wayfriend wrote:
Savor Dam wrote:
WF, you keep coming up with these concise insights.

Wink

Savor Dam wrote:
wayfriend wrote:
Without Troy, Elena could not have failed.

Why is Troy so pivotal to Elena's failure?

Well, I was thinking as I wrote that that Elena was free to follow Amok to the Seventh Ward because she was comfortable leaving Hile Troy to command the Warmark. Troy enabled Elena's decision to head out with Amok.

But, as I think on it now, I remember that Amok would not have ever been found in Revelwood if not for Troy spotting him and catching him.


This raises the questions of what Elena, Covenant, Bannor and Morin would have done had Amok not been caught by Troy and successfully interrogated by Amatin and Elena. In the absence of the huge temptation of being led by the Seventh Ward of Kevin's Lore to whatever surpassing power he was the guide to, it is easier to see Elena deciding to accompany Troy, Mhoram et al at the head of the majority of the Warward. We know that dire news was received and momentous decisions were made by Troy and Mhoram along that road. The presence of Elena and Covenant at those moments would have made huge differences, with who knows what consequences.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DrPaul wrote:
This raises the questions of what Elena, Covenant, Bannor and Morin would have done had Amok not been caught by Troy and successfully interrogated by Amatin and Elena.

Well, if we are considering a case where Amok is never "unlocked" at all, then I presume Elena and Covenant would have followed Troy to Kevin's Watch and Dooms retreat. One might think that perhaps Troy would not have been so desperate, and so might have failed. Or that Covenant would goad him to extremity, and so might have succeeded anyway. Or the enmity between Covenant and Troy would come to a crisis point, causing who knows what? Troy's death?

I'd like to think that, had the reached Garrotting Deep, the forestal might have respected Covenant's ring and asked no boon in return for delivering the Warward from Foul's army. Which would be a disaster.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wayfriend wrote:
I'd like to think that, had the reached Garrotting Deep, the forestal might have respected Covenant's ring and asked no boon in return for delivering the Warward from Foul's army. Which would be a disaster.


The forestal would have respected the Staff of Law more than the white gold ring. His boon might have been safe passage in exchange for the Staff.

The Elena-Troy love scenario would be reduced to a more prosiac affair, and the forestal would marry them on Gallows Howe.
Then like Dorothy saying goodbye to her friends, the forestal would wave his staff above Covenant sending him home.

The End - as the staff had been returned to the rightful owner Vain
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would have to take exception to that last assertion, but to explain why would involve Last Chronicles spoilers.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Savor Dam wrote:
I would have to take exception to that last assertion, but to explain why would involve Last Chronicles spoilers.

RAFO!


I'll just flat out say this - The Forestal cared NOTHING of Lords and their power (thus the Staff of Law would be nothing to him). It was too recent for them to pay attention to. Further, the lords of that time were nothing, in terms of power, compared to lords of old, who still would not brave Garrotting Deep.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Savor Dam wrote:
I would have to take exception to that last assertion, but to explain why would involve Last Chronicles spoilers.

RAFO!


I believe that Last Chronicles spoilers are permitted in The Entire Chronicles forum. Am I mistaken?
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 7:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Erring on the side of caution, CH, but you are technically correct. I just like to encourage folks to read...so we have new participants in the dissection and quiz threads.
Twisted Evil

bikebryan has it right, as passages in Fatal Revenant and The Last Dark make clear.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2019 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Savor Dam wrote:
Erring on the side of caution, CH, but you are technically correct. I just like to encourage folks to read...so we have new participants in the dissection and quiz threads.
Twisted Evil

bikebryan has it right, as passages in Fatal Revenant and The Last Dark make clear.


The comments I was primarily thinking of came from The Illearth War.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 06, 2019 3:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, there is ample support in The Illearth War that Wildwood took that view.
Spoiler:
However, in the Last Chrons, SRD showed glimpses of Wildwood millenia apart (both before and after) from the events of the First Chrons...and did a fairly seamless job of making the character consistent and believable across that span of time.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2019 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What surprised me most about this thread was not the veiled revelations of Kevin's Second Ward,
but understanding why the Elohim imprisoned Vain in Elemesnedene.

Spoiler:
Savor Dam wrote:
RAFO!
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 07, 2019 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Everyone knows why they imprisoned Vain in Elemesnedene.

Maybe you never read Gilden-fire?
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wayfriend wrote:
Everyone knows why they imprisoned Vain in Elemesnedene.

Maybe you never read Gilden-fire?

I read Gilden-fire a long time ago but have no idea what this has to do with Vain's imprisonment in Elemesnedene! Can you explain?

To return somewhat back on topic. While creating an ambient chillout pad today, it occured to me that music is so often the key to understanding how magic works in the Chronicles. For instance, how the company of the quest were able to cross Warrenbridge - that is, if you believe in such things. Very Happy
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 12:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lazy Luke wrote:
I read Gilden-fire a long time ago but have no idea what this has to do with Vain's imprisonment in Elemesnedene! Can you explain?

You can't change the rules now! That's not fair.

Lazy Luke wrote:
it occured to me that music is so often the key to understanding how magic works in the Chronicles. For instance, how the company of the quest were able to cross Warrenbridge - that is, if you believe in such things.

If you explain what music has to do with Warrenbridge, I'll explain what Gildenfire has to do with Elemesnedene.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

wayfriend wrote:
If you explain what music has to do with Warrenbridge, I'll explain what Gildenfire has to do with Elemesnedene.
.

I'll post the piece of music in the "Music inspired by the Chronicles" thread.
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