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The Illearth War - Chapters 15 and 16
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2003 2:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And remember he also seeks an escape from the madness of his dream - If he is just left alone, isn't given any responsibility, he can finish his visit to the Land and still be able to continue his life in the real world normally.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2003 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, the Land is certainly a constant threat to Covenant's survival. Every hour he spends there - touching and tasting and feeling - his leper's defenses wither. And when he returns home, as he knows he will, those defenses are all that keep him alive...
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2003 3:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Earthfriend you are credit to the Watch - beautiful summation!!

Welcome!!

I always felt HT was out of his element - in way over his head, but he still accepted the responsibility - sort oflikr the people of the land. They knew they were in over thier head, but were willing to take on the fight for the sake of the Land - unlike TC, who couldn't bear to think the land real, nor take part in it's defense, fearing it all an illusion and insanity his reward for acting to protect this world.

BTW Earthfriend, not many of us share the gift of brevity - carry on as much as you wish. Your insights will certainly enjoyed by myself & others I'm sure!!
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2003 4:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Earthblood wrote:
BTW Earthfriend, not many of us share the gift of brevity - carry on as much as you wish.
Yeah, it's pretty much just me and Sky.

Earthblood wrote:
Your insights will certainly enjoyed by myself & others I'm sure!!
No doubt whatsoever!!


(First part joking, second part serious Smile )
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2003 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Earthblood, glad to be here! Very Happy (We 'earthie' types gotta stick together Cool )

I like these chapters because Troy finally begins to realise just how much responsibilty he has taken upon himself. Suddenly he feels like the fate of the whole Land rests on his shoulders. He calls Covenant a coward for dodging his responsibilities, but i think he also begins to see why Covenant avoids them. It's this back-breaking pressure which eventually leads him to make such a foolish promise to the Forestal...but lets not get ahead of ourselves! Wink

F&F - Laughing And it i think brevity is not nearly as important as relavence and depth, which both you and Sky display in droves! Smile
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2003 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If paradox is tantamount 2 dealing w/Foul then what exactly is Troy's. We understand TC's and Mhoram's but what, really is Troy's? That simulation and reality can never b the same thing? Something else? Confused
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2003 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think all(?) power in the Land is linked to a paradox of one kind or another. All the trully 'powerful' characters have a personal paradox of one kind or another; TC, Mhoram, Foamfollower, the Bloodguard - even Foul himself, for all his strength, is powerless to escape the Arch of Time - paradox!

However, i don't think every character must have a paradox, just the very powerful ones. Perhaps HT doesn't have a huge paradox because he's not hugely powerful. Or perhaps his paradox is that for all his Land-born sight, he is still essentially blind. Question
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 11, 2003 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So if u equate simulatio Very Happy n vs reality 2 blindness we've just totally agreed!
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 12, 2003 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Uh yep, guess so! Very Happy And to think people have been acusing me of brevity - hah! Razz Wink
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2003 7:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Evenly and openly, Lord Mhoram said, 'I have no special virtue to make me resent him. One must have strength in order to judge the weakness of others. I am not so mighty.' (p.292)


Mmm.... I couldn't believe this when I read it again. Didn't remember it from before. It's a great argument for humility, isn't it? And you figure, if Mhoram felt this way, who are we??
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2003 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What an incredible quote!! Thanks for pointing that one out for me!!
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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2016 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The description of Revelwood in chapter 15 is one that challenges my imagination, as I can't quite take it all in how a tree could be so complicated in its growth. In a way, I find it easier to visualize the chaotic complexity of Revelstone, believe it or not. Having said that, though, I like how visualizing Revelwood gives me an immense feeling of "other-worldliness", of mentally breaking through to a place quite unlike anywhere I have imagined before.

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Across the valley was the Rill River, the southern boundary of Trothgard. Like the Maerl, the Rill had been greatly improved by the long work of the Lords, and the water which flowed from the Valley of Two Rivers no longer deserved the name Gray.

In the center of the valley, within the broad middle of the river V, was Revelwood, the tree city of the Loresraat.

It was an immense and expansive banyan. Invoked and strengthened by the new knowledge of the Second Ward, and by the Staff of Law, it grew to the height of a mighty oak, sent down roots which formed new trunks with new boughs and new roots--and spread out in the valley until the central core of the first tree was surrounded by six others, all intergrown, part of each other, the fruit of one seed.

Once these seven trunks were established, the shapers of the tree prevented any more of the hanging roots from reaching the ground, and instead wove the thick bundles into chambers and rooms--homes and places of study for the students and teachers of the Loresraat. Three of the outer trees had been similarly woven before their roots found the soil, and so now their trunks contained cavities large enough for meeting halls and libraries. On the sheltered acres of ground beneath the trees were gardens and practice fields, training areas for the students of both Staff and Sword. And above the main massive limbs of the trees, the lesser branches had been trained and shaped for leaf-roofed dwellings and open platforms.

Revelwood was a thriving city, amply supplied by the fertile lowlands of Trothgard; and the Loresraat was busier now than at any other time in its history. The Lorewardens and apprentices of the Sword and Staff did all the work of the city--all the cooking, farming, herding, cleaning--but they were not tis only inhabitants. a band of lillianrill lived there to care for the tree itself. Visitors came from all over the Land. Villages sent emissaries to seek knowledge from the Lorewardens; Hirebrands came to study the Tree; and Gravelingases used Revelwood as a dwelling from which to visit the rock gardens. And the Lords worked there to keep their promises to the Land.

As the riders looked down at it, its broad, glossy leaves caught the orange-red fire of the sun, so that it appeared to burn proudly above the shadows spreading down the valley. The company responded to the sight with a glad hail. Clapping their heels to their mounts, they galloped down the slope toward the ford of the Llurallin.

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PostPosted: Fri May 13, 2016 10:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
He was still in the lookout when he heard the signal for the gathering of the Loresraat.

at once, he took leave of the two students, and started down the Tree. Shortly, he reached the wide, roofless bowl of the gathering place. High in the city, on a frame of four heavy boughs radiating from the central trunk, the shapers of Revelwood had woven an immense net of banyan roots and hung it around the central trunk. It formed a wide basin supported by the four outer boughs radiating from the central trunk, the shapers of Revelwood had woven an immense net of banyan roots and hung it around the central trunk. It formed a wide basin supported by the four boughs and anchored by the roots themselves in each of the six outer trees. The result was the viancome, a meeting place large enough for half the population of the city. People sat on the roots and dangled their feet through the gaps of the net.

These gaps were rarely larger than a foot square, but they made the viancome an uneasy experience for novices. However, the people of Revelwood moved and even ran lightly over the net. Warmark Troy, with a blind man's alert, careful feet, was able to walk confidently away from the central trunk to join Drinishok and the other Sword Lorewardens where they stood partway up one side of the bowl.

Lord Amatin was already there, talking intently with a cluster of Staff Lorewardens and advanced students. Most of the Blood guard were stationed around the edge of the net, and past them came a steady flow of Revelwood's inhabitant. As Troy joined Drinishok, he caught sight of Lord Mhoram moving across the bowl toward Amatin. If the viancome caused Mhoram any anxiety, he did not show it; he strode boldly from root to root with his staff held in the crook of his arm.

Soon High Lord Elena arrived in the company of the Staff-Elder, Asuraka. Troy was taken slightly aback; he had expected her to be with Corimini, the Eldest of the Loresraat. But when Corimini entered the bowl, he brought with him ur-Lord Covenant. Troy saw what had happened. The Loresraat ranked Covenant above Elena, and so the highest honor of Revelwood's hospitality, the invitation of the eldest, had gone to the Unbeliever. This nettled Troy; he did not like to see the High Lord slighted in favor of Covenant. But he consoled himself by watching the sick look with which Covenant regarded the net and fall below it.


I myself would not look upon the prospect of enting such a room with confidence, being somewhat acrophobic. But I get the feeling that Troy is being very petty here, as he has so much more to contemplate with so many lives dependent upon his plans. Maybe this is one of Troy's greatest weaknesses, that he can get so emotionally invested in situations he cannot control (such as how the Loresraat treats Covenant, or in what choices High Lord Elena makes), that it makes him more prone to despair. At least he can see how some of his dilemma is of his own doing, as in the following passage:

Quote:
He would have to win.

If he did not, then he was more than a failure; he was an active evil--a piece of treachery perpetrated against the Land in defiance of his own love or volition--worse than Covenant, for Covenant at least tried to avoid the lie of being trusted. But he, Hile Troy, had deliberately sought trust, responsibility, command--

No, that thought was intolerable. He had to win, had to win.

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PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2016 7:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Troy's lack of fear when it comes to climbing around the viancome is an indication that he trusts in his own infallibility and therefore doesn't take into account the consequences of personal failure. Whereas Covenant fears completely, for the analogous but opposite reason. This one simple thing paints them as clear foils of each other.
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PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2016 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wayfriend wrote:
I think Troy's lack of fear when it comes to climbing around the viancome is an indication that he trusts in his own infallibility and therefore doesn't take into account the consequences of personal failure. Whereas Covenant fears completely, for the analogous but opposite reason. This one simple thing paints them as clear foils of each other.


It does, indeed! Shocked Exclamation
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