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Health care reform: market solutions
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 9:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Repealing Obamacare in the House" is a symbolic victory, at best. It still has to pass the Senate and the fight will be more difficult there.

Still, Republican Members of the House who won their seat by campaigning to repeal Obamacare couldn't lose with this vote. As long as they voted to repeal they may truthfully tell their constituents "I did what you sent me to Washington to do" and this may be enough for some of them to win reelection in 1.5 years.

It must have been difficult working for health insurance providers the past few years, though. "Oh, good--we are going to get lots of new customers as people sign up for our plans through the Exchanges." "Oh, phooey--the Exchanges aren't being set up as quickly or efficiently as we need them to but we'll tough it out." "Oh crap--we are literally losing the shirt off our back--time to abandon the Exchanges or go bankrupt."

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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2017 10:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hashi, symbolic at best? At best, it's the beginning of the end of ACA. At worst it's symbolic. It's possible that the Senate won't pass it, but it's not likely. Some form of "Republicare" will be passed.

I don't understand the negativity. People were determined to poop all over the Republicans just a few weeks ago and proclaim them a failure on this very issue. Now, they've done exactly what people said they couldn't do, and we still have to say something negative about it? Why not acknowledge that this is a victory and massive course correction in the history of our country?

Republicans will determine the future of health care access for the next decade or so. We will be able to directly compare it to the failure of the Democrats' vision. The difference will be stark.

Just watch and see.
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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 1:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not being negative about it, only realistic. Until the Senate passes something a bill passing the House is just a collection of papers with no significance.

Some guy on another forum said "this bill will kill people". That comment was so ridiculous that I left it alone--you cannot reply to something like that in a serious manner. I keep mentioning to people over there to drop by here but none of them have so far, as far as I know. Perhaps I should keep mentioning The Tank to them.

Also, Democrats chanting "na na na na, hey hey hey, goodbye" as if Republicans are going to lose any seats over this next election. Quite the contrary--I bet Republicans gain seats in the House during midterms.

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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, saw the headlines, but when I read it, realised it wasn't quite a done deal yet.

agree with Z though...from a Rep point of view, symbolic will be the worst case outcome.

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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's nothing. It's a re-tooling of the ACA, not a repeal.
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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cail, while it's not a full repeal, it is a repeal of the most important aspects of ACA. It gets rid of the government subsidized exchanges, it gets rid of the unconstitutional mandate (regardless how the SCOTUS ruled), doesn't force you to buy types of insurance you don't need, and it takes care of people with preexisting conditions without forcing insurance companies to cover them. This is a major injection of freedom back into the market.

I think we still don't know much of the details of the bill.
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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank God we passed the bill in order to see what's in it.
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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 6:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cail, I said 'we,' not Congress. I'm sure they knew what was in it.

I don't think the details of many bills are widely known among the public a day after they're passed. None of us read them. We rely on the media. The public debate on this bill has just begun.
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Remain faithful to the earth, my brothers, with the power of your virtue. Let your gift-giving love and your knowledge serve the meaning of the earth ... Do not let them fly away from earthly things and beat with their wings against eternal walls. Alas, there has always been so much virtue that has flown away. Lead back to the earth the virtue that flew away, as I do-back to the body, back to life, that it may give the earth a meaning, a human meaning. -Nietzsche
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PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let me show what's gonna happen to that bill when it hits the Senate:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/76/Book_burning.jpg
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PostPosted: Sat May 06, 2017 1:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pretty much.
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PostPosted: Sat May 06, 2017 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seems like nothing more than ACA v. 2.

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PostPosted: Sat May 06, 2017 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In what way does it seem like ACA 2?

Few bills go straight from the House to the Senate without changes. It's possible we could get a much better bill after the Senate rewrites it.

This is all just part of the process. It's why we have all these branches of government, after all.
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Remain faithful to the earth, my brothers, with the power of your virtue. Let your gift-giving love and your knowledge serve the meaning of the earth ... Do not let them fly away from earthly things and beat with their wings against eternal walls. Alas, there has always been so much virtue that has flown away. Lead back to the earth the virtue that flew away, as I do-back to the body, back to life, that it may give the earth a meaning, a human meaning. -Nietzsche
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PostPosted: Sat May 06, 2017 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Always said. You don't vote in a new bad set of rules to replace the
original bad set of rules.

I think they should drop back 10 yards and punt.
ACA was beginning to unravel. Let it.
ACA is nothing more than forcing people to have insurance.
If there is a rise in healthcare then the insurance cost go up.
Besides ACA really has no teeth... that is a part of the unraveling.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now we finally get to it: Bernie Sanders is going to introduce "Medicare for All" legislation into the Senate today; the proposed legislation has 15 other co-sponsors but Democracy Now doesn't list who they are.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 13, 2017 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is even more meaningless than the multiple repeal bills passed by Republican Congresses over the last few years. It would go nowhere, even if it were more than a political stunt. Until the Dems spell out exactly how they'd pay for this, they're not serious.

Bernie Sanders' New Single Payer Plan Is a Wild Legislative Fantasy
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Remain faithful to the earth, my brothers, with the power of your virtue. Let your gift-giving love and your knowledge serve the meaning of the earth ... Do not let them fly away from earthly things and beat with their wings against eternal walls. Alas, there has always been so much virtue that has flown away. Lead back to the earth the virtue that flew away, as I do-back to the body, back to life, that it may give the earth a meaning, a human meaning. -Nietzsche
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 18, 2017 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I heard on the radio--looking for confirmation via some other source--that the Senate is going to try and repeal/replace the ACA again this week.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hashi Lebwohl wrote:
Now we finally get to it: Bernie Sanders is going to introduce "Medicare for All" legislation into the Senate today; the proposed legislation has 15 other co-sponsors but Democracy Now doesn't list who they are.


I feel sorry for the US - for all who struggle and suffer under a lack of affordable health care. Here it's free .. to a degree. We have Medicare - it works. People keep wanting to meddle with it ..

I was injured a few years back .. was clinically dead, was on life support and machines to ventilate, one that stimulated the heart muscle etc. for a month.
I'd be 6' under but for the Australian Medicare system. I had months of rehab after, I was in a pretty bad way. Medical costs were more than I could have ever afforded.

If it happened in the US - I think I'd be screwed! LOL
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, you'd probably get the care, but they'd hound you for the rest of your life over the bills. Very Happy

Now here in SA, you'd really be screwed.

(What happened?)

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hahahaha!! 😂 *note to self don't move to SA*

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 2:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Skyweir wrote:
I feel sorry for the US - for all who struggle and suffer under a lack of affordable health care. Here it's free .. to a degree. We have Medicare - it works. People keep wanting to meddle with it ..


This is what is so aggravating about our health insurance/health care system--people keep claiming that it isn't affordable but, in reality, it is. Of course, it isn't affordable when your highest aspiration is working at Wal-Mart or Burger King and you want $15 per hour. If you want good health care, get some computer skills and get a better job. Or, if your primary goal is "I want affordable, quality medical coverage" then join the military and go on TriCare. Of course, if your number one goal in life is "affordable, quality medical coverage" then we need to address your system of priorities....

Yes, there are people with pre-existing conditions for whom health coverage is either not available or, if available, not affordable by any stretch of the imagination. That is a shame, but sometimes the genetic lottery gives people a losing situation (presuming the condition didn't happen from an accident or some sort of negligent injury suffered at the workplace or by exposure to some substance).

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