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A Prosaic Confession
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ussusimiel
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 2:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zarathustra wrote:
U, I like the Insequent, actually..... The way SRD has fit them into the history and the present of the Chronicles is an astonishing bit of retro-fitting.

Agreed, he managed to hang a huge amount from the thinnest of straws; a few glimpses through the fog and a Haruchai myth out of nowhere (only acceptable because they're such a laconic bunch Big Grin ). However, my poor brain begins to weep when I think of the history of the Old Lords and not a peep about this hugely important figure (with the unforgettable name of the Theomach Shocked ) who knew, at least, both Berek and Damelon and also not a whiff of the Insequent in the previous six books.

They have great names though. When I joined the Watch I had only read the start of FR and hadn't come across the name Insequent so I was intrigued at people using names like the Theomach and I think I initially thought that they must be from a fantasy series by another author that I didn't know about.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seareach wrote:
MsMary wrote:
So, this thread was moved leaving no trace in its forum of origin? Does the thread author know? I'm assuming he's not here, since he said he hasn't read AATE yet...

Seems like some notification in the SRD forum would be left.


Yes, he was and what kind of notification should I have left? I wasn't going to leave a shadow topic as (if I understand correctly it leaves all the past posts and some of them have spoilers in them).


Other forums I've been on have a feature where the mod puts "Moved" in front of the forum title. When you open the "moved" thread, you get only a link to where the thread has been moved, not the complete thread. The complete thread is now in the spot to which it has been moved. I don't know if you can do that on this forum software or not, but this is not a newer forum software feature. I've seen it on other forums for years and years.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ron Burgunihilo wrote:
I appreciate your concern, I was PM'd about it. It's cool.


Glad to hear it.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Although I hesitate to criticize a free site run by volunteers, the forum software does seem a little dated. Don't kill the messenger!
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey! Don't go changing the software Surprised

It'll never be as good as the first two versions and I know I'll hate all the new features and they won't have the fluency and integration of the originals and isn't it fine as it is anyway Mad

[Thought I'd get that in before danlo Big Grin ]

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 11:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ussusimiel wrote:
Zarathustra wrote:
U, I like the Insequent, actually..... The way SRD has fit them into the history and the present of the Chronicles is an astonishing bit of retro-fitting.

Agreed, he managed to hang a huge amount from the thinnest of straws; a few glimpses through the fog and a Haruchai myth out of nowhere (only acceptable because they're such a laconic bunch Big Grin ). However, my poor brain begins to weep when I think of the history of the Old Lords and not a peep about this hugely important figure (with the unforgettable name of the Theomach Shocked ) who knew, at least, both Berek and Damelon and also not a whiff of the Insequent in the previous six books.

They have great names though. When I joined the Watch I had only read the start of FR and hadn't come across the name Insequent so I was intrigued at people using names like the Theomach and I think I initially thought that they must be from a fantasy series by another author that I didn't know about.

u.


Wasn't one of the character's in 'Mordant's Need' called the Monomach or something?
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2012 11:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hiro wrote:
ussusimiel wrote:
Zarathustra wrote:
U, I like the Insequent, actually..... The way SRD has fit them into the history and the present of the Chronicles is an astonishing bit of retro-fitting.

Agreed, he managed to hang a huge amount from the thinnest of straws; a few glimpses through the fog and a Haruchai myth out of nowhere (only acceptable because they're such a laconic bunch Big Grin ). However, my poor brain begins to weep when I think of the history of the Old Lords and not a peep about this hugely important figure (with the unforgettable name of the Theomach Shocked ) who knew, at least, both Berek and Damelon and also not a whiff of the Insequent in the previous six books.

They have great names though. When I joined the Watch I had only read the start of FR and hadn't come across the name Insequent so I was intrigued at people using names like the Theomach and I think I initially thought that they must be from a fantasy series by another author that I didn't know about.

u.


Wasn't one of the character's in 'Mordant's Need' called the Monomach or something?


Yes, High King Festen's assassin was called the King's Monomach.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 2:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ron Burgunihilo wrote:
Although I hesitate to criticize a free site run by volunteers, the forum software does seem a little dated. Don't kill the messenger!


They've talked about upgrading but I don't know why they decided not to at this point in time...then Vain disappeared (and he's the guy who does all that kind of technological thingy-whatsit Smile )

Oh and, Ms Mary, I'm 99.99% sure we don't have anything like that here, hence why in the normal Gen Discussion there's a thread telling people where threads have been moved to. All's well that ends well--I think most people have found it.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 3:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hopefully he'll be back. Smile
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"It is not the responsibility of knights errant to discover whether the afflicted, the enchained and the oppressed whom they encounter on the road are reduced to these circumstances and suffer this distress for their vices, or for their virtues: the knight's sole responsibility is to succour them as people in need, having eyes only for their sufferings, not for their misdeeds." Don Quixote


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 6:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seareach wrote:
Ron Burgunihilo wrote:
Although I hesitate to criticize a free site run by volunteers, the forum software does seem a little dated. Don't kill the messenger!


They've talked about upgrading but I don't know why they decided not to at this point in time...then Vain disappeared (and he's the guy who does all that kind of technological thingy-whatsit Smile )

Oh and, Ms Mary, I'm 99.99% sure we don't have anything like that here, hence why in the normal Gen Discussion there's a thread telling people where threads have been moved to. All's well that ends well--I think most people have found it.


It's not difficult to replicate this technological marvel in our "antique" site. All you have to do is leave a post containing a link to the new location. Problem solved at the cost of a single bareboned monopost thread.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 6:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just check the option to leave a shadow topic in the move menu.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I need a manual! Wink
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why, you've got a Murrin.
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"Constant development is the law of life, and a man who always tries to maintain his dogmas in order to appear consistent drives himself into a false position." Gandhi

"It is not the responsibility of knights errant to discover whether the afflicted, the enchained and the oppressed whom they encounter on the road are reduced to these circumstances and suffer this distress for their vices, or for their virtues: the knight's sole responsibility is to succour them as people in need, having eyes only for their sufferings, not for their misdeeds." Don Quixote


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ron Burgunihilo wrote:
Hopefully he'll be back. Smile


Amen! Smile
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- Is all right special Time Lord code for really not all right at all?

- You're all irresponsible fools!
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Murrin wrote:
Just check the option to leave a shadow topic in the move menu.


That's what I'm talking about. I just couldn't remember what to call it.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 07, 2012 11:25 pm    Post subject: On a pedestal Reply with quote

My comment seems fitting, though at first read a little disconnected. Of all of the books or SRD's that I have read (have never read the Axbrewder? novels) he has never written anything as good, where character and plot are expertly interwoven, like the 1st Chrons and The Gap series. The 1st Chrons is a masterpiece and the Gap books are fairly well on their heels. Between these two series, I have had my interest in other authors' material muted to an infuriating level. It is hard to get interested in anything else. The Wheel of Time was great for a while, then too many characters and subplots ruined it, not to mention Jordan's passing. Sorry Sandersen, you are no Jordan (nor are you Donaldson).

Sigh.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I lost hope after forcing myself through AAE. Up until then i was on the fence. Really, what was all that about? Dungeon crawl, pointless. The worst trip to Mount Thunder yet. The Bane, totally uninteresting and out of place. The desecration of Elenas soul, hard to believe. The killing off of several main players, a yawn. The death of Joan... What? It just feels to me like the author fell out of love with his own story and characters and is struggling to tie up loose ends just because he feels he has to. And worse, feels he has to prove a capability to write more complex plots aquired with age. Ive more or less decided to not include the last cronicles in my own TC canon. Where im concerned, the series ended beautifully in WGW. It actually picked up very promisingly in ROTE, but went to hell quickly after Linden was transported to the land. I could not have imagined a worse general plot, and i fail to see why it takes four books to finish it. And why, three books into it, it still feels so vague and weak.

Oh well. Ill be reading this forum to check up on your reactions when the last book comes out. Hoping for an unlikely miracle.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Atrium wrote:
It actually picked up very promisingly in ROTE, but went to hell quickly after Linden was transported to the land.

That's a good point. A while back I re-read the start of ROTE again and it was fine, but like you say, as soon as we entered the Land it went awry. In FR when we went back in time to meet Berek and Damelon, again it was fine. Some of it may have to do with how many characters from our world are now involved in the world of the Land: Covenant, Linden, Hile Troy, Joan, Jeremiah, Roger. It's a regular crowd now and none of the later additions seem, to me, to be integral to the Land itself in the way that Covenant, Linden and Hile Troy were in the 1st and 2nd Chrons.

None of the powers these characters have in the Land seem 'necessary' to me and I think that is reflected in the writing. Jeremiah's power seems interesting in a quantum physics kind of way, but as we have no access to his character (as far as I've read in AATE at any rate) I, at least, have no real conception of what it signifies (and this is 2 1/2 books into the series Shocked ).

u.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 12:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ussusimiel: I agree completely. The new characters feel sketchy. Roger is supposed to be the main antagonist here? I still, after three books, havent got an emotionally satisfactory explanation as to why he hates his father so bitterly. In my mind the best part of the last chronicles were the hike back in time to drink earthblood. While this was a rerun, Donaldson playing a safe card, we also got some interesting interactions between the antagonists and la protagonista. But apart from that episode, the bad guys sudden appearances and disappearances, shooting off crazy wild powers casually like it aint no thang, has all the feel of our fantasy role play sessions when we were 13 years old.

It would take a real master to salvage this and tie up all the knots nicely in the last book. But i doubt that will happen. I just dont feel the emotional connection author/story anymore.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2012 1:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Atrium wrote:
the bad guys sudden appearances and disappearances, shooting off crazy wild powers casually

These are two of my big problems with the Last Chrons, what I call 'Willy-nillyness' and 'Magic Maths'. Willy-nillyness is the ability to move from one place to another without effort, for me this removes a huge quest element from any fantasy novel. Think of how much pleasure we get in the two earlier Chrons from the long journeys and the fantastic voyages. Imagine just being able to zap into Elemesnedene and zip out again. No struggle, no effort and essentially nothing learned or gained. Ditto Gravin Threndor and Foul's Creche.

Magic Maths is the lining up of essentially incommensurate powers, balancing the algebraic formula and then settling the conflict by adding a new element. In the battle of magics under Melenkurion Skyweir (in FR) there is a stalemate until Linden dips the Staff into EarthBlood, but, for me, it's just a plot device. I'll admit that it's a cool plot device but in some way it also seriously risks damaging our reverence for the mystery of EarthBlood by using it this way. As to the battle at First Woodhelven, don't get me started, so far this has been the nadir of Magic Maths Mad

u.
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