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A Positive Thread About TLD
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Frostheart Grueburn
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2013 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lurch wrote:
So , there is the Sword and Moan so far.


Well, swords will induce moaning when handled with dexterity in battle and elsewhere.

I, on the other foot, was wondering when the Giantesses would get ribalder. Pitchwife had his share of badwy jokes, after all. And in any case they felt like a Malazan troop of gentle Toblakai, particularly with Grueburn's constant taunting of the Ironhand.


I had a cameo character called Furdlesail in a TCTC story. Here we meet Furledsail. Also Keenedge and Keenreef. That was...weird.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2013 11:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps a name for the Giant Appreciation Society.." Sword and Moan,,"

Yes,,after some of the fun the author had with the members of the Swordmain in AATE , I believe it was, I was on the look for some clever humor. In AATE, was it, the author had haruchai go fetch water using a Giants breast plate armor to carry the water...a visual joke I suppose,,he brought plenty of water back. There were a few others that the author denied with a wink of an eye when asked about, but here in TLD the Giants get to actually say the humor lines..Yes, it fills them out as characters.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 8:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pfff hahaha I noticed that during my AATE adventures and sniggered accordingly. Donaldson's equivalent to the gag in How to Train Your Dragon where Hiccup and his daddy recycled parts of the deceased mother's armor as...two helmets.
Don't forget they used the backplates as well, but I do wonder if the front parts fetched more water... Later, this detail made me revise Grueburn's figure. She was the first one whose armor Coldspray began tearing off for the same purpose, and the Giants required far ampler amounts of sustenance. Big Grin

What did the "word of god" deny, apart from Kindwind not producing musical wind?

I do wish SRD had a capacity for yet more humor, like Steven Erikson. Still, while we may not behold duos like Tehol/Bugg (or later Karsa/Samar), the Giants do dilute the grimdark angst soup a tad.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 29, 2013 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

F..yes I asked about the musical wind coming from Kindwind,( was it the first time into the Viles water palace?). in the Gradual Interview and he coyly danced around it as I recall..We first meet the Swordmain rather undone in the tight overgrown forest so there was a hint of comedy about them from the start.

But geesh..honoring their dead seems a hurried necessity and second to Telling A Great Story. Ya gotta have a oversized sense of humor to face todays daily struggles I suppose.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 4:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Borillar wrote:
I thought it was strange the way TLD seemed to leave some loose threads, like the escape of Moshka, the continued struggle of Covenant to control the Despiser, Branl's desire to go recapture the Krill, etc. WGW left some loose ends like that, but I wouldn't have expected them in this book when SRD has made it clear that this is The End.


I was fine with Covenant's continued struggle with the Despiser. It was making the point that we all have to deal with our internal Despisers.

Branl's finish mirrored Bannor's and Cail's.

The Moshka escape though bothered me a lot. I could see no larger point to it. It smelled of leaving a loose thread for yet another sequel. Note: I don't think SRD will write one.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 6:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

slickthomas wrote:
Borillar wrote:
I thought it was strange the way TLD seemed to leave some loose threads, like the escape of Moshka, the continued struggle of Covenant to control the Despiser, Branl's desire to go recapture the Krill, etc. WGW left some loose ends like that, but I wouldn't have expected them in this book when SRD has made it clear that this is The End.


I was fine with Covenant's continued struggle with the Despiser. It was making the point that we all have to deal with our internal Despisers.

Branl's finish mirrored Bannor's and Cail's.

The Moshka escape though bothered me a lot. I could see no larger point to it. It smelled of leaving a loose thread for yet another sequel. Note: I don't think SRD will write one.


The moksha escape was necessary for Jeremiah to contribute in an uncorrupted way to the re-creation of the world, and the circumstances at that point in the story didn't allow for a holding and rending of moksha. In any case there's not a lot that moksha can do as long as Covenant keeps Lord Foul passive. As SRD has pointed out, the Ravers are absolute minions - "plain old tools" - of the Despiser.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

lurch wrote:


But geesh..honoring their dead seems a hurried necessity and second to Telling A Great Story. Ya gotta have a oversized sense of humor to face todays daily struggles I suppose.


Aye, aye, struggles, akin to that fire-spitting half-dragon half-troll I had to impale with my glaive on the very doorstep of my workplace this morn...now let me inform you what befell when a dragon, a troll, and a frost giantess walked into a bar...

I recall that both Squareset and Wavegift perished after Rime's first long-winded yammer concerning Longwrath and his ancestors within the past 100000+ years. Very Happy So the story would not have been out of place.

Right. Some of their jests in AATE flew a bit over my head, though. This required me three attempts before I unlocked the meaning of the flowery language. Perhaps says something about my username?

Confusing jokes in AATE wrote:
"By your leave, Grueburn will assume the guardianship of your staff in the event that the Feroce essay another approach. We cannot be assured that her mind will not also fall into glamor, as yours did. However--"
"It will not," put in Onyx Stonemage. "You speak of Grueburn, whose natural bewilderment excludes other confusion."
"Fie and folly, Stonemage," Grueburn retorted. "Breathes there a Giant upon the wide Earth whose acquaintance with bewilderment is as intimate as your own?"
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My most favourite part of TLD was the three chapters before the end of the first part, after the fane was completed and all were resting, and after Linden's return. I don't want to preempt any dissections, but it seemed to me that several questions were answered in those chapters - for the characters themselves. It was the calm before the storm. For me the sojourns under Mount Thunder or the other place (Ridjek Thome?) with all the fighting have never been the most enjoyable reading. The next "best bit" was Linden's meeting with SWMNBN at the end. I've had to read it several times for the meaning of it to filter through. The gradual change in Stave, and especially Branl, was a joy to read.
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 16, 2013 7:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DrPaul wrote:


The moksha escape was necessary for Jeremiah to contribute in an uncorrupted way to the re-creation of the world, and the circumstances at that point in the story didn't allow for a holding and rending of moksha. In any case there's not a lot that moksha can do as long as Covenant keeps Lord Foul passive. As SRD has pointed out, the Ravers are absolute minions - "plain old tools" - of the Despiser.


Also, it might be calling back to the idea that every creation has to have a flaw or imperfection in it; you can't have absolute perfection.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 1:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like a lot of what has been said and liked here.
I like that once they swap rings and marry, the rings draw responses from each other.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 3:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DrPaul wrote:


The moksha escape was necessary for Jeremiah to contribute in an uncorrupted way to the re-creation of the world, and the circumstances at that point in the story didn't allow for a holding and rending of moksha. In any case there's not a lot that moksha can do as long as Covenant keeps Lord Foul passive. As SRD has pointed out, the Ravers are absolute minions - "plain old tools" - of the Despiser.


I disagree with most of this. The Ravers' wills were subsumed by Foul - as SRD answered my several Qs about the Ravers in the GI. Without his will, I believe their own will re-emerge. There is no evidence that Foul changed their natures or "reprogrammed" their minds. He just dominated them.

Now that moksha is free of Foul's influence, I believe he will morph into a powerful adversary in his own right.

Sauron/Melkor syndrome.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 10:23 am    Post subject: A Positive Thread About TLD Reply with quote

Cord Hurn wrote:
Thank you, Frostheart! I was wondering what joke of Coldspray's SleeplessOne was referring to. I get it, now. Embarassed


this was the exchange I was referring to Cord Hurn :

Quote:
"Indeed!" exclaimed Onyx Stonemage. "I will give my oath that I am dwindling. Hunger diminishes me. My garments hang loosely, and my cataphract has become an encumbrance, and I fear that my sword has grown too long for easy use."
For a moment, the Giants were silent. Then Coldspray said like a sigh, "You forget to whom you speak, Stonemage. All here know that in your care every sword grows too long for easy use."


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Horrim Carabal wrote:
DrPaul wrote:


The moksha escape was necessary for Jeremiah to contribute in an uncorrupted way to the re-creation of the world, and the circumstances at that point in the story didn't allow for a holding and rending of moksha. In any case there's not a lot that moksha can do as long as Covenant keeps Lord Foul passive. As SRD has pointed out, the Ravers are absolute minions - "plain old tools" - of the Despiser.


I disagree with most of this. The Ravers' wills were subsumed by Foul - as SRD answered my several Qs about the Ravers in the GI. Without his will, I believe their own will re-emerge. There is no evidence that Foul changed their natures or "reprogrammed" their minds. He just dominated them.

Now that moksha is free of Foul's influence, I believe he will morph into a powerful adversary in his own right.

Sauron/Melkor syndrome.


I think moksha will be nothing more than a nuisance. Also, I could see Caerwood ur-Mahrtiir and the Demondim spawn keeping a close eye on him.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

howabout moksha being the weakness that makes everything else stronger...?
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 23, 2013 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The other senses of TLD ...not the cold or heat,,but the emotional,,and shading of the Darkness and,the olfactory of Defiles Course. There is a hint of what is to come in the beginning,,with Linden stretching her health sense to its maximum reach in detecting Kevins Dirt.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 28, 2013 3:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The play out, or pay off, consequences, of making a deal with the Lurker and his acolytes , the Feroce. Spanning two of the books at least, AATE and TLD; the arc of that relationship is a fine example of creativity by the author. There are many magnificent tributaries tied to the main themes of the Last Chrons flowing thru the Feroce/ Lurker arc.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 3:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

lurch wrote:
howabout moksha being the weakness that makes everything else stronger...?


I don't think so.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The author splitting the Plot Time line between Linden and TC seemed a gamble at first but I am left amazed on how at all the different levels it was necessary And it worked.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 9:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Moksha would continue to be a formidable adversary. Assuming other parts of the world of the Chronicles continue to exist, it's easy to imagine his causing major problems elsewhere, for instance.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 31, 2013 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was made to actually smell the Defiles Course,,Sarangrave Flat and the Lifeswallower. To be able to relate to such olfactory assaults brings Proustian moments. hhhmmm..the LC as an ode to Proust?
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