Kevin's Watch Forum Index
 HomeHome   MemberlistMemberlist   RegisterRegister   SearchSearch   ProfileProfile   FAQFAQ   StatisticsStatistics  SudokuSudoku   Phoogle MapPhoogle Map 
 AlbumAlbum StoresStores   StoresItems Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Grimmand Honninscrave, Gossamer Glowlimn and Bahgoon?

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Kevin's Watch Forum Index -> The First and Second Chronicles of Thomas Covenant
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Forestal
Bloodguard


Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 899

Thanks: 3
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts

Location: Andelain
230 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:


PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 1:45 pm    Post subject: Grimmand Honninscrave, Gossamer Glowlimn and Bahgoon? Reply with quote

So, throughout the chronicles, the giants for the most part have a theme for their naming.
Saltheart Foamfollower - sea compass, Vigilall Scudweather - something to do with perceptiveness, Sparlimb Keelsetter - carpenter or shipwright.
The list goes on of giants with names which describe their appearance, or work, or abilities.

Except these three, unless there is a meaning to their names which I am unaware of? (while Gossamer Glowlimn could mean something like 'thinly veiled artwork', I don't think that describes the First in any reasonable fashion.)

I have a poorly thought out theory that the seemingly meaningless nature of their names is SRD's way of giving a portent as to their likelihood to be immortalised in giantish tales at a later date. Bahgoon the Unbearable does describe himself, but "the unbearable" isn't his name, it's his title, so I don't think this counts as it was likely assigned to him for the purpose of the story. Grimmand of course is well worthy of story, being the first known being to at least assist in destroying a Raver. Gossamer... I confess my memory of her is faded because I haven't read the second chronicles in a decade, but the search for the Unhomed is certainly a giantish tale worth remembering.

The exception to this rule is perhaps Saltheart Foamfollower - who we all know is the most worthy giant of tales in the entirity of Covenant. But Saltheart is one of the Unhomed - lost to the giants and the Unhomed are all dead, there are no more tales to be told.

Thoughts?
_________________
"Damn!!! Wildwood was unbelievably cool!!!!!" - Fist&Faith
"Yeah Forestal is the one to be bowed to!! All hail Forestal of the pantaloon intelligencia!" - Skyweir
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
wayfriend
whilom witling

Male
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 18673

Thanks: 11
Thanked 207 Times in 190 Posts

Location: The world of the Bowling Green Massacre
42337 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
3 Member of Linden's Army


PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 3:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, Glowlimn is clearly glow + limn, both are regular words. Literally it means having a glowing aura. Certainly apropos. Remember, this is Pitchwife's "pet" name for his wife. He's clearly contrasting the inner delicacy that he knows with her exterior hardness.

Also:

In the Gradual Interview, Stephen R Donaldson wrote:
Sadly, the truth is less interesting than your speculations. I started with something along the lines of "Grim-hand Honors-crave," but that seemed rather (if I may say so) heavy-handed, so I blurred the syllables. I didn't want to make it *too* obvious that he had a special fate. To be consistent, of course, I should have thrown in a few other similar names; but alas....

(08/14/2006)


Bahgoon remains a mystery. However, I suspect that it arises in a similar way (Donaldson's comment to the contrary). Big + Goon ?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Forestal
Bloodguard


Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 899

Thanks: 3
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts

Location: Andelain
230 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:


PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well that's a less than satisfying reveal Sad

I should probably read some of that interview.. I see it referenced a lot and I've never done so.
_________________
"Damn!!! Wildwood was unbelievably cool!!!!!" - Fist&Faith
"Yeah Forestal is the one to be bowed to!! All hail Forestal of the pantaloon intelligencia!" - Skyweir
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
wayfriend
whilom witling

Male
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 18673

Thanks: 11
Thanked 207 Times in 190 Posts

Location: The world of the Bowling Green Massacre
42337 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
3 Member of Linden's Army


PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Gradual Interview is very rewarding but it's also very, very long. I followed it as it came out, a couple questions a week. Reading it from end-to-end would be daunting, like reading 10 years of facebook posts at once.

That being said, it's useful if you search it for specific things.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
IrrationalSanity
Caamora Obscura


Joined: 15 Oct 2004
Posts: 1344

Thanks: 1
Thanked 15 Times in 15 Posts

Location: Someplace birds sing
1207 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
1 Leela V1.01 Member of Linden's Army1 Translation


PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 5:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It strikes me that in Giant society, one's "adult" name is bestowed or earned at some key point as they grow up.

Could you imagine, for example, the proud parent in Seareach naming her triplets "Kin Slaughterer" or "Satan's Fist"? "Flesh Harrower"? I didn't think so.

Cable Seadreamer was given his name when the accident with the cable triggered his Earth Sight.

Gossamer was probably a giant of rare beauty, gaining that name before becoming the First of the Search.
_________________
- Woody -
Linden Lover and proud of it...
But I love my wife more!

"Desecration requires no knowledge. It comes freely to any willing hand." - Amok
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Skyweir
Lord of Light


Joined: 16 Mar 2002
Posts: 10522

Thanks: 15
Thanked 35 Times in 35 Posts

Location: Australia
10599 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
1 Lord's Staff1 Oath of Peace1 Furls Fire


PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Then they aren't names given at birth or immediately thereafter .. they are nicknames, names earned in life or youth or adventure.

I like that better .. yes good point with the triplet names. I wonder who "Satan" is to the Land .. its surely more than just a name
_________________
health and healing

'Smoke me a kipper .. I'll be back for breakfast!'
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
Forestal
Bloodguard


Joined: 19 Feb 2003
Posts: 899

Thanks: 3
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts

Location: Andelain
230 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:


PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To reference a totally unrelated story world - in D&D 3.5, Dragonlance, the Kagonesti (Wood Elves) would have a birthname (often like a Native American name - Sitting Wolf or Pouncing Tiger, that sort of thing) and would take on a new name when they came of age (between 30-45 years old) which represented their current life choices. It isn't unusual for a Kagonesti to change their name multiple times during their life to represent who they have become, I wouldn't be surprised if giants did a similar thing.

Although, it would seem a little egotistical of Gossamer to choose a name for herself which basically said to the world "Look how gorgeous I am!".
_________________
"Damn!!! Wildwood was unbelievably cool!!!!!" - Fist&Faith
"Yeah Forestal is the one to be bowed to!! All hail Forestal of the pantaloon intelligencia!" - Skyweir
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
IrrationalSanity
Caamora Obscura


Joined: 15 Oct 2004
Posts: 1344

Thanks: 1
Thanked 15 Times in 15 Posts

Location: Someplace birds sing
1207 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
1 Leela V1.01 Member of Linden's Army1 Translation


PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 5:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Forestal wrote:
To reference a totally unrelated story world - in D&D 3.5, Dragonlance, the Kagonesti (Wood Elves) would have a birthname (often like a Native American name - Sitting Wolf or Pouncing Tiger, that sort of thing) and would take on a new name when they came of age (between 30-45 years old) which represented their current life choices. It isn't unusual for a Kagonesti to change their name multiple times during their life to represent who they have become, I wouldn't be surprised if giants did a similar thing.

Although, it would seem a little egotistical of Gossamer to choose a name for herself which basically said to the world "Look how gorgeous I am!".


Yes, the concept is one applicable to several other societies. In the case of the Giants, I don't think the names are normally self-selected, though they may have the opportunity to suggest and/or veto. I might wonder if Gossamer was her birth name. It certainly is one that a parent might give her daughter in hopes of growing into.
_________________
- Woody -
Linden Lover and proud of it...
But I love my wife more!

"Desecration requires no knowledge. It comes freely to any willing hand." - Amok
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
wayfriend
whilom witling

Male
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 18673

Thanks: 11
Thanked 207 Times in 190 Posts

Location: The world of the Bowling Green Massacre
42337 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
3 Member of Linden's Army


PostPosted: Thu Feb 01, 2018 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In The Wounded Land was wrote:
"To me," he whispered, so that the First could not hear him, "she is named Gossamer Glowlimn."

In The One Tree was wrote:
After a moment, he commenced by saying, "Perchance it has come to your ears that I am husband to the First of the Search, whom I name Gossamer Glowlimn."

It's clear to me that Gossamer Glowlimn is Pitchwife's private name for his wife, and no one else uses it. Hence, I call it a "pet name".

In Fatal Revenant was wrote:
"With clumsiness and inattention, I have shamed the Swordmainnir as well as myself. Henceforth I will name myself Lax Blunderfoot. When our journey has come to its end, for good or ill, I will lay down my sword."

Again, there is a suggestion that Giants have "private" names - names which they and no one else would use, whether it be for themselves or someone else.

So: I don't think that Giants change their names so much as they acquire private names which accompany their actual ones.

In Fatal Revenant was wrote:
"Linden Avery, the third son of the third son of Glowlimn and Pitchwife was Exalt Widenedworld. But now the Giants of Home name him Lostson, and among the Swordmainnir he is called Longwrath."

Even here we can see the same pattern -- if you allow for the fact that a community (and the Giants form close communities) or a small group might share a private name for a Giant.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Kevin's Watch Forum Index -> The First and Second Chronicles of Thomas Covenant All times are GMT
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by Earthpower © Kevin's Watch