Kevin's Watch Forum Index
 HomeHome   MemberlistMemberlist   RegisterRegister   SearchSearch   ProfileProfile   FAQFAQ   StatisticsStatistics  SudokuSudoku   Phoogle MapPhoogle Map 
 AlbumAlbum StoresStores   StoresItems Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

maps of locations outside of the Land

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Kevin's Watch Forum Index -> The First and Second Chronicles of Thomas Covenant
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Doug0915
Servant of the Land

Male
Joined: 30 Jun 2011
Posts: 9

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts


48 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:


PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 5:26 pm    Post subject: maps of locations outside of the Land Reply with quote

I've been poking around the net looking for maps to trace the progress of our heroes/villains in the chronicles, but other than a generic map of the Land, there does not seem to be anything outside of that, even though in for instance "The One Tree" the quest takes them to the island where the Elohim live and the port city of the Bhrathair.

Is there an other maps than the one for "The Land"?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Savor Dam
Will Be Herd!

MaleRanyhyn
Joined: 02 Mar 2009
Posts: 5133

Thanks: 55
Thanked 81 Times in 77 Posts

Location: Pacific NorthWet
1218 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
1 2009 Watchies1 Furls Fire1 Love


PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, there are maps of both Bhrathairealm and Elmensedene in the front matter of The One Tree.

No copy handy? See them here:
http://mapsoffantasy.tumblr.com/post/54026548717
_________________
Love prevails.
~ Tracie Mckinney-Hammon

Have patience with everything unresolved in your heart and to try to love the questions themselves as if they were locked rooms or books written in a very foreign language. Don't search for the answers, which could not be given to you now, because you would not be able to live them. And the point is, to live everything. Live the questions now. Perhaps then, someday far in the future, you will gradually, without even noticing it, live your way into the answer.
~ Rainier Maria Rilke
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Phoogle Map
Thanked by: Cord Hurn
Doug0915
Servant of the Land

Male
Joined: 30 Jun 2011
Posts: 9

Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts


48 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:


PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Savor Dam wrote:
Yes, there are maps of both Bhrathairealm and Elmensedene in the front matter of The One Tree.

No copy handy? See them here:
http://mapsoffantasy.tumblr.com/post/54026548717


Very Handy, thanks! Is there any map (or anything else) that indicates where/how far these two places are from the Land proper?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Savor Dam
Will Be Herd!

MaleRanyhyn
Joined: 02 Mar 2009
Posts: 5133

Thanks: 55
Thanked 81 Times in 77 Posts

Location: Pacific NorthWet
1218 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
1 2009 Watchies1 Furls Fire1 Love


PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To the best of my knowledge, there are no maps or sea charts showing how these locations (nor others such as Home or Isle of the One Tree) relate to each other or to the Land.

Other Chrons scholars may know more and chime in.
_________________
Love prevails.
~ Tracie Mckinney-Hammon

Have patience with everything unresolved in your heart and to try to love the questions themselves as if they were locked rooms or books written in a very foreign language. Don't search for the answers, which could not be given to you now, because you would not be able to live them. And the point is, to live everything. Live the questions now. Perhaps then, someday far in the future, you will gradually, without even noticing it, live your way into the answer.
~ Rainier Maria Rilke
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Phoogle Map
peter
the spider from Mars


Joined: 25 Aug 2009
Posts: 7288

Thanks: 38
Thanked 49 Times in 48 Posts


27245 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:


PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 5:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's on first thinking an appealing idea that there should be a map of 'The World', but on thinking it out a bit I have my doubts. One of the main themes of the first two series was that those greatest of travellers, the Giants, were Unhomed by virtue of their lack of such, there oral tradition not withstanding. Part of the very fabric of the stories is the mystery of the world beyond the shores of the Land- vague mentions of the origins of the Insequents and of the homeland of Kasreyn of the Gyre are made - but in the main, of the distant realms and their geographical relationship to each other we are in the dark for good narrative reasons. To speculate just a little further however, I'd have a guess that the globe of The Land is much bigger than our own, with distances between major land masses much greater.
_________________
http://jhfv.blogspot.co.uk/

....and the glory of the world becomes less than it was....
'Have we not served you well'
'Of course - you know you have.'
'Then let it end.'

We are the Bloodguard
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
wayfriend
whilom witling

Male
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 18825

Thanks: 11
Thanked 214 Times in 197 Posts

Location: The world of the Bowling Green Massacre
43059 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
3 Member of Linden's Army


PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's been on my bucket list for some time now to mine the text of the One Tree and develop an approximation of the relative locations of things. There should be enough directional data ("sailed southwest") and distance data ("for three days") to do a rough placement. Plus there are some good descriptions of the coast of Brathairealm.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Cord Hurn
Servant Of The Band

MaleRanyhyn
Joined: 28 Oct 2013
Posts: 4821

Thanks: 966
Thanked 43 Times in 40 Posts

Location: Alpine, Arizona, USA
4144 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
1 Plains of Ra1 Furls Fire1 Andelain


PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 11:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Doug0915, This isn't technically a "map", but I wanted to give you a link to Blackhawk's beautiful painting of the Isle of the One Tree, just in case you haven't seen it:
http://kevinswatch.ihugny.com/phpBB2/album_page.php?pic_id=1926
_________________
Jehannum
The Celebration of Spring

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Phoogle Map
peter
the spider from Mars


Joined: 25 Aug 2009
Posts: 7288

Thanks: 38
Thanked 49 Times in 48 Posts


27245 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:


PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 4:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting that Blackhawk refers to the isle "before it crumbled into the sea". Was this strictly the case? Did not the Isle rather submerge itself, ready to reappear at need (though iirc it never actually did so) wheresoever in the Land it choses to?
_________________
http://jhfv.blogspot.co.uk/

....and the glory of the world becomes less than it was....
'Have we not served you well'
'Of course - you know you have.'
'Then let it end.'

We are the Bloodguard
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Cord Hurn
Servant Of The Band

MaleRanyhyn
Joined: 28 Oct 2013
Posts: 4821

Thanks: 966
Thanked 43 Times in 40 Posts

Location: Alpine, Arizona, USA
4144 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
1 Plains of Ra1 Furls Fire1 Andelain


PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 5:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

peter wrote:
Interesting that Blackhawk refers to the isle "before it crumbled into the sea". Was this strictly the case? Did not the Isle rather submerge itself, ready to reappear at need (though iirc it never actually did so) wheresoever in the Land it choses to?


In Chapter 27 of The One Tree was wrote:
In silence, the questers trudged up out of the tomb of their dreams.

Tremors threatened them repeatedly during that hard ascent. The ledge pitched as if it sought to shrug them back into the gulf. Vibrations made the stone quiver like wounded flesh. At intervals, hunks of rock fell, striking out sharp resonations which scaled upward like cries of bereavement. But Linden was not afraid of that. She was hardly aware of the exertion of the climb. She felt that she could count the last drops of blood as they seeped around the knife in Covenant's chest.

When she gained the crest, looked out over the Isle and the wide sea, she was wanly surprised to see that the sun had fallen no lower than midafternoon. Surely the ruin of the quest had consumed more time than that? But it had not. Such damage was as sudden as an infarction. As abrupt as the collapse of the old man on the roadway into Haven Farm
Slowly, irresistibly, the violence in the rock continued to build. As she started downward, she saw that the slopes were marked with new scars where boulders and outcroppings had fallen away. The old sea had swallowed all the rubble without a trace.

The last throes of the Isle were rising. Though she was hardly able to walk without stumbling, she urged the company faster. It was her responsibility. Covenant was so Desecration-ridden, so despair-blind, that he would have plunged headlong if Cail had not supported him. She needed help herself; but Brinn was gone, the First and Pitchwife were occupied with Honninscrave, and Call's duty was elsewhere. So she carried her own weight and croaked at her companions for haste. As awkwardly as cripples, they raced the Worm's unrest downward.

Vain followed them as if nothing had changed. But his right hand dangled from the dead wood of his transformed forearm. The band of the Staff of Law on his wrist clasped the boundary between flesh and bark.

At last, they reached the longboat. Somehow, it had not been struck by any of the falling boulders. The companions lurched and thudded aboard as if they were in rout.

As the First shoved the craft out into the water, the entire eyot jumped. A large section of the crest crumbled inward. The sea heaved into deep waves, setting the longboat a-dance. But it rode out the spasms unscathed. Then the First and Pitchwife took the oars and rowed through the sunlight toward Starfare's Gem.

The next tremor toppled more of the Isle's crown. Wide pieces of the engirdling reef sank. After that, the convulsions became almost constant, raising immense exhalations of dust like spume from the island's throat. Impelled by heavy seas, the longboat moved swiftly to the side of the Giantship. In a short time, the company gained the decks. Everyone gathered along the port rail to watch the cairn of the One Tree go down.

It sank in a last tremendous upheaval. Chunks of the Isle jumped like flames as its foundations shattered. Then all the rock settled around the Worm's new resting-place; and the sea rushed into the gap. The waters rose like a great geyser, spread outward in deep undulations which made the dromond roll from side to side. But that was the end. Even the reef was gone. Nothing remained to mark the area except bubbles which broke the surface and then faded, leaving azure silence in their wake.

Slowly, the spectators turned back to their ship. When Linden looked past Vain toward Covenant, she saw Findail standing with him. She wanted to be angry at the Elohim, would have welcomed any emotion which might have sustained her. But the time for such things had passed. No expostulation would bring back Covenant's hope. The lines engraving the Appointed's face were as deep as ever; but now they seemed like scars of pity.

"I cannot ease your sorrow," he said, speaking so softly that Linden barely heard him. "That attempt was made, and it failed. But one fear I will spare you. The One Tree is not destroyed. It is a mystery of the Earth. While the Earth endures, it too will endure in its way. Perhaps your guilts are indeed as many as you deem them--but that is one you need not bear."


The Isle of the One Tree did submerge itself, but there is no mention of it being able to reappear anywhere in the Land's world.
_________________
Jehannum
The Celebration of Spring

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Phoogle Map
wayfriend
whilom witling

Male
Joined: 21 Apr 2004
Posts: 18825

Thanks: 11
Thanked 214 Times in 197 Posts

Location: The world of the Bowling Green Massacre
43059 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
3 Member of Linden's Army


PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the Gradual Interview, Stephen R Donaldson wrote:
Perhaps I never made it clear that over long spans of time the One Tree, well, moves around. Such archetypal creations don't cease to exist: the sinking of the Isle didn't unmake the One Tree, but simply took it out of reach. I've always assumed that when Berek found the One Tree it was somewhere else entirely, and that the challenges of approaching it and obtaining wood from it were (apart from the Guardian, another archetypal creation) entirely different than those faced by Covenant et al.

(09/10/2004)

This may be where the notion that the Isle would reappear elsewhere arises.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
peter
the spider from Mars


Joined: 25 Aug 2009
Posts: 7288

Thanks: 38
Thanked 49 Times in 48 Posts


27245 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:


PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes - I'm probably conflating this with other stories of sinking and reappearing islands that I've come across in the past; I had the idea that the giants had spoken of it in these terms before - but that's probably just a 'made-up' memory. My [addled] brain has the capacity to do that Laughing
_________________
http://jhfv.blogspot.co.uk/

....and the glory of the world becomes less than it was....
'Have we not served you well'
'Of course - you know you have.'
'Then let it end.'

We are the Bloodguard
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
amanibhavam
subterranean homesick jheherrin

Male
Joined: 12 Mar 2002
Posts: 1497

Thanks: 3
Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts

Location: United Kingdom
393 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:
1 Diamondraught


PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't currently have access to it and it has been a long time since I last looked at it, but Karen Fonstad's Atlas of the Land contains maps of locations in the First and Second Chronicles, although I honestly cannot remember if it has any 'worldwide' maps.
_________________
------------------------------------------------------------------------
love is the shadow that ripens the wine

Languages of Middle-Earth community on Google Plus
Pink Floyd community on Google Plus
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Phoogle Map
peter
the spider from Mars


Joined: 25 Aug 2009
Posts: 7288

Thanks: 38
Thanked 49 Times in 48 Posts


27245 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:


PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 4:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No I don't believe it does- but it's very detailed in respect of chronicling the times taken on specific journeys and estimating distances IIRC. A good starting point for anyone who wanted to attempt the task of drawing a World Map I should think. Smile
_________________
http://jhfv.blogspot.co.uk/

....and the glory of the world becomes less than it was....
'Have we not served you well'
'Of course - you know you have.'
'Then let it end.'

We are the Bloodguard
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Nanothnir
Elohim


Joined: 07 Jan 2018
Posts: 199

Thanks: 1
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts


1324 White Gold Dollars
Tokens
HP

User Items:


PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

amanibhavam wrote:
I don't currently have access to it and it has been a long time since I last looked at it, but Karen Fonstad's Atlas of the Land contains maps of locations in the First and Second Chronicles, although I honestly cannot remember if it has any 'worldwide' maps.


I own a copy and could probably post a picture from a specific part of the atlas if you want something specific.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Kevin's Watch Forum Index -> The First and Second Chronicles of Thomas Covenant All times are GMT
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by Earthpower © Kevin's Watch