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Deadhouse Gates [Spoilers]
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 03, 2011 4:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, the Spoiler:
siege of Capustan
in MOI was pretty vivid.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just finished DG, and am left astonished. Well done Steven Erikson I shall continue. My favorite character was Fiddlers biting horse.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 4:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, there is more and better to come. Very Happy Enjoy. Very Happy

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This post is full of DG SPOILERS - if you haven't finished the book, don't read this post.

I finished it a few hours ago. I want to go straight on and read MOI, but I still feel like I need to remember how to breathe first.

I knew something of how the Chain of Dogs was going to end because I'd already stumbled across spoilers. Coltaine, I could cope with because it seemed inevitable that he would have died in battle, even if it hadn't been that one, and I actually felt a sense of pride, awe - or something - when the crows came. Duiker ..... I had to stop reading for a while because I'm sure you're not supposed to get ebook readers wet. (That's the first time I've cried at a book since the end of TPTP!)

Icarium and Mappo ..... there's so much tragedy there. I want to read more about them (and I've seen enough hints dropped to know I will), but I'd almost rather be told Icarium has given up searching for his memories, and they've found a quiet and peaceful place to live Happily Ever After.

This doesn't mean the other story threads meant nothing - Fiddler, Kalam, Felisin - just that those are the ones I can't stop thinking about at the moment.

Trying to get my head together ..... there is one thing that puzzled me. When Laseen was talking to Kalam (and I'd seen mention of this earlier - maybe Duiker's thoughts?) she said the whole thing with Dujek was about creating an army that was separate from the Empire that could forge alliances with the other powers in the area. She actually said, "we needed Anomander Rake and his Tiste Andii." So, why did Lorn try to kill Rake? I know releasing the demon could have been Tayschrenn's idea, and he has revealed himself as a bit of a wild card, but surely freeing the Jaghut tyrant was on Laseen's orders. If this is made clear in MOI, I'll obviously get to it, but otherwise it seems like a glaring discrepancy to me. Is it, or will all be revealed later on?
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 04, 2011 9:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think things are implied later on, keep in mind that the Empire is "Rake's enemy." If the Tiste Andii are to believe that Dujek and his army really are separated from the Empire, they need to have a good, convincing reason.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2011 4:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wasn't the thing with the tyrant well before the outlawing? Originally, they needed Rake to take out the tyrant once it had threatened the city.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm .... so what did the Empire trying to kill Rake have to do with convincing him that Dujek and his army was outlawed?

Avatar, I'm pretty sure Lorn freed the tyrant on the same day (or the day before) as Dujek told Whiskeyjack about the outlawing, which had presumably been planned for a while. As far as I could tell from Lorn's thoughts, the plan was that Rake would get involved in defeating the tyrant, and then wouldn't have enough strength left for the demon. Considering that Tayschrenn had an excellent opportunity at Pale to judge Rake's strength, it really looks to me like they were trying to kill him. He admits himself (once to Silannah, and again to Crokus) that the fight against the demon could go either way.

If they were trying to kill him, that doesn't make sense if they were also trying to gain him as an ally for Dujek. If they weren't trying to kill him, I don't see the point of the whole thing. He already wasn't particularly fond of the Malazan Empire, and would probably have got involved against the new threat anyway, once the Empire was off the scene, simply because it needed to be stopped. (Having only read a few hundred pages of MOI, I'm making some assumptions here, but I think they're fairly safe ones.)

I'm hoping it will become clear because it's still bothering me.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 10:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They still (at least some of them) had to act like the Empire. If they didn't, things would be... well, awkward...

However, I think the main reason (which I'll spoiler because I don't know if it is a spoiler, hopefully some one else will confirm it) is the following:

Spoiler:
It seems like at this moment Taschy was also kinda acting on his own.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2011 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's what I was leaning towards (the spoilered part), although I haven't seen any definite evidence of it yet. It makes sense.

I'm OK with the way Erikson leaves a lot of questions unanswered for a long time because I always feel they'll be answered at some point, even if it's a few books down the line. But that particular story seemed to be finished with at the end of GOTM, which is why it confused me.

It isn't affecting my enjoyment of MOI, though!
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2012 12:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, finished Deadhouse Gates a while ago now. My opinion is that it is second best to MoI of the books I've read so far. Close second. The Chain of Dogs was brutal and poignant and even hilarious at times (the lapdog, for example). Felisin had me swinging between fury and compassion. Coltaine and the Wickans are just sheer badass.

I could go on, but put it this way. If I'd read this before MoI, I'd say it was the best fantasy I'd ever read.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 4:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I vacillate between the two as favourite...or HoC...Damnit! Laughing

Welcome back btw. Wink

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, it's an extraordinary couple of books to read one after the other! I've read the first four books three times. Each time I've read DG, initial and rereads, I've thought there couldn't possibly be a better book. Then I read MoI, and couldn't believe it is.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 7:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Onos T'oolan wrote:
Yeah, it's an extraordinary couple of books to read one after the other! I've read the first four books three times. Each time I've read DG, initial and rereads, I've thought there couldn't possibly be a better book. Then I read MoI, and couldn't believe it is.


umhm. <bobs head emphatically> same here. same exact experience.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thing I found interesting was reading HoC immediately after DG. So much time in Seven Cities and Raraku without the intended stop over in Genabackis for MoI. My throat felt parched when I finished. Laughing
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