The Latest Potentially-Explosive Racially-Charged Murder II

Fist and Faith · Posted: Sun Dec 27, 2020 4:14 pm Post subject:

What kind of education teaches them that, I wonder.

I also wonder: how many people were interviewed; how many self-identified as being in what group; how many that identified as being in each group said those things; how many who identified as Conservative said it, but we were not told about it. I saw interviews of Trump supporters saying the most idiotic things imaginable. Doesn't mean Trump opposers don't say some of those same idiotic things, and doesn't mean all Trump supporters think those idiotic things. It's possible that the interviewer wants to find support for a point s/he started with, presented evidence that supports it, and buried evidence to the contrary.
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We are not required to save the world. We are required to stand up as truly as we can for what we love. -SRD

All lies and jest
Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest -Paul Simon

Obi-Wan Nihilo · Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:39 am Post subject:

Fist and Faith · Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:57 am Post subject:

Agreed. I think it's insane, literally, to not require ID to vote.
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We are not required to save the world. We are required to stand up as truly as we can for what we love. -SRD

All lies and jest
Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest -Paul Simon

Hashi Lebwohl · Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:20 am Post subject:

wayfriend · Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 2:01 pm Post subject:

Hashi, as terrible as it is, lots of people die, and lots of people are murdered.

Yet, you seem fixated on, and continually report on, and continually cherrypick, those deaths and those murders which you can use as an excuse to denigrate blacks and black issues.

Why so fixated on denigrating blacks and black issues? Why not report on some other deaths and other murders?
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* I occasionally post things on KevinsWatch because I am a fan of Stephen R. Donaldson; this should not be considered as condonation of the white nationalist propaganda which is posted far too frequently on this website.

Brother ur-Nan · Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 2:49 pm Post subject:

Hashi Lebwohl · Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 3:23 pm Post subject:

wayfriend · Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:06 pm Post subject:

Hashi Lebwohl · Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:34 pm Post subject:

Brother ur-Nan · Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2020 1:06 am Post subject:

Are you saying that black culture is the problem because it "does not value education, hard work, or valuing women?"

Savor Dam · Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2020 2:46 am Post subject:

Nano, please re-read what Hashi said. The attributes you claim he is attributing to Black culture are what he was associating with thug culture, and he explicitly states that he does not equate thug culture with Black culture.

Play nice, y'all.
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Love prevails.
~ Tracie Mckinney-Hammon

Have patience with everything unresolved in your heart and to try to love the questions themselves as if they were locked rooms or books written in a very foreign language. Don't search for the answers, which could not be given to you now, because you would not be able to live them. And the point is, to live everything. Live the questions now. Perhaps then, someday far in the future, you will gradually, without even noticing it, live your way into the answer.
~ Rainier Maria Rilke

TheFallen · Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2020 9:29 am Post subject:

I seriously do not understand why more than a few here continually misinterpret what others have taken great pains to very clearly state - and can only assume that it is the formers' preconceptions and agendas which lead to the same error being repeatedly made.

The premise is both simple and self-evident:-

Anti-societal subcultures do NOT arise as any result of ethnicity.

Anti-societal subcultures arise as a result of economic deprivation and its related symptoms, such as poorer educational standards, lower employment opportunities and far less stable familial environments.

The above remains true, no matter whether one terms any given anti-societal subculture as"thug", "trailer trash", "ghetto" or "gang".

The root cause of such anti-societal subcultures is EXCLUSIVELY socioeconomic and NOT ethnic.

Furthermore, such anti-societal subcultures are very largely self-perpetuating.

And that's pretty much an all-encompassing summary.

Of course, then a perfectly reasonable and small set of follow-up questions arise, such as:-

"Why on average do a statistically significant number of black Americans live in notably more socioeconomically deprived environments?"

and

"What if anything can be reasonably attempted in an effort to remedy such extant disadvantage?"

To my mind, THOSE are the questions - and especially the second one - that need discussion and answers being sought.

Several of us have specifically tried to bring this up and on more than one occasion. Sadly however, the core motivation on the part of some here seems merely to be to level a facile accusation of racism at others - an obsession which entirely detracts and distracts from any chance of talking over the REAL issue at hand.

Such thoughtless and kneejerk accusations strongly appear to be no more than entirely counter-productive "Look how woke I am!" virtue-signalling - which of course achieves precisely nothing at all in terms of attempting to address any real current issues. In fact it actively hampers and derails any such efforts.

And that is a real shame.
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Newsflash: the word "irony" doesn't mean "a bit like iron" Rolling Eyes

Shockingly, some people have claimed that I'm egocentric... but hey, enough about them

"If you strike me down, I shall become far stronger than you can possibly imagine."
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* I occasionally post things here because I am a fan of SRD.

This should not be considered as any condoning of the hypocritical, snowflake, bleeding heart, white guilt-ridden, compulsively virtue-signalling and totalitarian prog Left woke zealotry which some try to force upon this forum.

Avatar · Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2020 11:44 am Post subject:

Damn good post.

wayfriend · Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2020 1:27 pm Post subject:

The problem with TF's post is that he is pretending that the contention resides somewhere where it can be comfortably mocked, but that's not where the contention is.

There's no such thing as "thug" culture, first of all. "Gangster culture" is the more appropriate term I would say.

"Thug" is a well-known dog whistle used to denigrate blacks. So the use of the term is notable. That is what is offensive.

No one has an issue with being "against" gangster culture. However, considering it to be synonymous with black culture -- and yes, Hashi said that no, I didn't, but you don't bother to read what people write-- is what is offensive.

Singling out gangster culture, and only black gangster culture, as being problematic is offensive. The racism resides, despite TF lying about where it resides, in REPEATEDLY singling out one group for our attention, a group chosen by race even though race is not a factor it.

Similarly, no one has an issue with being "against" murder. But REPEATEDLY singling out one subset of crimes - black-on-black crime - for our attention, a subset chosen by race even though race is not a factor in it, is offensive.

REPEATEDLY mocking BLM for what it doesn't do, and generally trying to prove it is NOTHING BUT ill-intentioned, is offensive. There are real racial issues that need to be resolved, and this effort is obviously designed to undermine any attempt to do so.

So, TheFallen, it would help if you would discuss what was really under discussion. We don't need more red herrings. In this context, they just serve racism by opposing the fight against racism. Or is that the intent?
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* I occasionally post things on KevinsWatch because I am a fan of Stephen R. Donaldson; this should not be considered as condonation of the white nationalist propaganda which is posted far too frequently on this website.

TheFallen · Posted: Tue Dec 29, 2020 1:49 pm Post subject:

WF, your groping at straws in a vain attempt to invalidate only serves to amuse.

I again specifically stated that the term used to describe any anti-societal subculture is irrelevant. To that end, I gave a definitively non-exhaustive list of possible options by which to describe such.

To head off your latest farcical attempt to level accusations of racism, the core issue remains anti-societal subcultures arising from economic deprivation - and what people choose to name these subcultures is of course entirely irrelevant to that. I personally don't care what terms people choose.

And exactly where am I "lying about where racism resides"? Do please tell. Specifically and with evidence. For once try having the intellectual courage to own and justify your words - or shut the fuck up with your pathetic and groundless race-baiting allegations.

In fact, I'm not "lying" about anything - I'm instead highlighting an entirely non-racial causative factor - in fact, THE causative factor - behind anti-societal subcultures... namely socioeconomic deprivation.

THAT is by far and away the most crucial issue worth discussing and trying to come up with a solution for. It's a far FAR bigger problem than any current active racism - and I find your inability to see this literally staggering. Not least because it negatively affects such a significantly higher proportion of black Americans.

However, you carry on calling people "liars" and "racists" as much as you like, just to feed your blinkered and smug self-righteousness. I'm happy to cede that I will never be as studiedly "woke" as you are so determined to be.

(Primarily because I'd rather deal with reality and actually discuss any potential ameliorative actions, instead of merely compulsively and tritely virtue-signalling and flinging accusations around from your self-awarded moral high ground).

It is genuinely tragic how clueless and un-self-aware you are, WF. You're seemingly not in the least interested in dealing with by miles the most significant remaining primum mobile, but would far rather just wring your hands and beat your breast publicly, while of course first making sure that everyone's looking on to witness your self-assumed moral superiority.

Because that's the whole objective for you, whether you realise it or not. And it's as tiresome as it is utterly misguided.

Does ongoing active racism still exist? Undoubtedly amongst some. Is it the biggest problem faced today by black America? Not by a million miles.
_________________
Newsflash: the word "irony" doesn't mean "a bit like iron" Rolling Eyes

Shockingly, some people have claimed that I'm egocentric... but hey, enough about them

"If you strike me down, I shall become far stronger than you can possibly imagine."
_______________________________________________
* I occasionally post things here because I am a fan of SRD.

This should not be considered as any condoning of the hypocritical, snowflake, bleeding heart, white guilt-ridden, compulsively virtue-signalling and totalitarian prog Left woke zealotry which some try to force upon this forum.

wayfriend · Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:05 pm Post subject:

TheFallen · Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:10 pm Post subject:

Hashi Lebwohl · Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:32 pm Post subject:

Fist and Faith · Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:00 pm Post subject:

What are you getting all worked up about? Don't you know more blacks are killed by blacks than by police?
_________________
We are not required to save the world. We are required to stand up as truly as we can for what we love. -SRD

All lies and jest
Still a man hears what he wants to hear
And disregards the rest -Paul Simon

Hashi Lebwohl · Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 10:57 pm Post subject:

I am not getting worked up. I am pointing out that a clear-cut case of police committing murder against a 12-year-old boy is not being prosecuted. Tamir Rice is one of the cases that led directly to this thread in the first place.
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