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PostPosted: Wed Jun 17, 2020 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

+JMJ+

Intra-Thread Trackbacks: pg17


Equal rights win at the court is worth celebrating, no matter what US bishops' conference thinks [Opinion]

Quote:

A person runs with a gay pride flag in front of the U.S. Supreme Court building June 15 in Washington. In a 6-3 vote that same day, the Supreme Court said LGBT people are protected from job discrimination by Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. (CNS/Reuters/Tom Brenner)


There seems to be one phrase missing from most of the commentary I have read about the U.S. Supreme Court's decisions Monday in the three cases Bostock v. Clayton County, Georgia, R.G. & G.R. Harris Funeral Homes Inc. v. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission and Altitude Express Inc. v. Zarda. The court decided, in a 6-3 decision written by Justice Neil Gorsuch, that Title VII of the 1964 Civil Rights Act's ban on discrimination based on sex extends to gay and transgender employees. The phrase that is missing is "common sense."

[...]

Future cases might require the court to consider First Amendment or RFRA claims, but these defendants advanced no such claims. One defendant, Harris Funeral Homes, did pursue such a claim in a lower court, but they did not present it in their petition to the Supreme Court.

It is a sign of how far and how fast our cultural reference points have changed that very few Republican members of Congress criticized the ruling. Of course, those who did criticize the ruling because they thought the court was usurping a legislative function failed to point out that Congress has routinely failed to legislate in this, and other, areas. Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell may think he can command time to stand still, but it marches on with or without him.

The response from the U.S. bishops' conference was, unsurprisingly, shrill and hysterical. "By erasing the beautiful differences and complementary relationship between man and woman, we ignore the glory of God's creation and harm the human family, the first building block of society," Archbishop José Gomez, president of the conference, said.

I missed that part of the decision: Where, exactly, did the court say that the differences between male and female were erased? No, the court said those differences could not be the basis for discrimination in a secular workplace. There is nothing in the teaching of our church that keeps us from celebrating this decision.

I understand that there are some conservative Catholics, many of them in the higher reaches of the Catholic hierarchy and staff at the U.S. bishops' conference, who believe that societal acceptance of homosexuality is the hill on which the church should stand, and fight, and die. And I understand that some issues, such as gay marriage, are a tougher lift theologically than some of my progressive friends seem to think. But I worry that the U.S. bishops' conference will decide to support another round of litigation, based on the premise that they are not firing this person or that because he or she is gay, but because that person entered into a gay marriage. I hope they resist that temptation. I fear they won't. The conference is still so removed from the concerns of the average person in the pew, they do not see that for every loud, obnoxious anti-gay letter from a culture warrior Catholic they fret over, five other Catholics are walking out the door because they are tired of the culture wars being preached from the pulpit.

Monday, the Supreme Court, in one sense, did nothing more than apply the plain meaning of a statutory text to a new situation. In another sense, the court helped rid our culture of the residual anti-gay bigotry that for so long characterized it. In a third and deeper sense, the high court helped expand and fulfill one of our nation's foundational promises: equal justice under the law. That is a thing to celebrate.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2020 5:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No one cares what the U. S. bishops' conference thinks under any circumstances.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2020 11:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, some people probably do. Very Happy But don't worry about them, they only vote... Very Happy

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2020 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

+JMJ+

Intra-Thread Trackbacks: pg 17 / pg 18


Editorial: L.G.B.T. discrimination protections are not a catastrophe for Catholicism [Opinion]

Quote:




A person runs with a gay pride flag in front of the U.S. Supreme Court building in Washington June 15, 2020. In a 6-3 vote that same day, the Supreme Court said LGBT people are protected from job discrimination by Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. (CNS photo/Tom Brenner, Reuters)


In a major advance for the civil rights of L.G.B.T. people, the Supreme Court of the United States decided this week that workplace discrimination based on an individual's sexual orientation or gender identity is prohibited by Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. As Catholics consider how to respond, they should distinguish carefully between reacting to this judicial ruling and the larger question of how to evangelize the culture, not only regarding sexual morality but also human dignity and justice in all aspects of life.

[...]

Yet prescinding from the question of the proper relationships among the branches of the federal government, the ruling's practical effect, which bans workplace discrimination against L.G.B.T. people, is a good one. No U.S. citizen should be fired simply because that person belongs to the L.G.B.T. community. This is consistent with the clear teaching in the Catechism of the Catholic Church that "every sign of unjust discrimination [against homosexual persons] should be avoided" (No. 2358).

In the majority opinion, Justice Neil Gorsuch was careful to point out that this decision does not address conscience protections for religious institutions or the so-called ministerial exception, which the court is expected to treat in future cases. The editors of America have long supported such an exception, which is in line with the constitutional guarantees made to religion.

Should the court decide to carve out such an exception, however, it does not necessarily follow that religious institutions should avail themselves of it. As we noted in 2016, "the high public profile of these firings [of L.G.B.T. employees who choose to marry], when combined with a lack of due process and the absence of any comparable policing of marital status for heterosexual employees, also constitute signs of 'unjust discrimination.'"

As with the Obergefell decision, this ruling also affords the church an opportunity to reimagine its public witness. The vocation of Catholics is to exercise moral suasion to influence the opinion of the citizens of the United States. There is little chance of success if we go about this work with the "culture warrior" attitude of so many politicians and public figures over the past decades.

This mindset reaches its extreme when the courts are treated as a third house of the legislature rather than as a separate branch of government entrusted with its own distinct tasks. What the law is and what the law should be are different questions. Confusing the two, as too many warriors and commentators do, has only further paralyzed the legislative process by allowing our eager legislators to pass the buck to the courts.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 18, 2020 4:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wosbald's latest copy n paste wrote:
In a major advance for the civil rights of L.G.B.T. people, the Supreme Court of the United States decided this week that workplace discrimination based on an individual's sexual orientation or gender identity is prohibited by Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. As Catholics consider how to respond, they should distinguish carefully between reacting to this judicial ruling and the larger question of how to evangelize the culture, not only regarding sexual morality but also human dignity and justice in all aspects of life.

[...]

Yet prescinding from the question of the proper relationships among the branches of the federal government, the ruling's practical effect, which bans workplace discrimination against L.G.B.T. people, is a good one. No U.S. citizen should be fired simply because that person belongs to the L.G.B.T. community. This is consistent with the clear teaching in the Catechism of the Catholic Church that "every sign of unjust discrimination [against homosexual persons] should be avoided" (No. 2358).
Disingenuous much?

I'd have said that an absolutely blatant sign of "unjust" discrimination is the Catholic Church's continuing condemnation of homosexuality as "grave depravity" and "intrinsically disordered".

The catechism of the Catholic Church wrote:
Chastity and homosexuality

2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity, tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered." They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.

2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God's will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord's Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.

2359 Homosexual persons are called to chastity. By the virtues of self-mastery that teach them inner freedom, at times by the support of disinterested friendship, by prayer and sacramental grace, they can and should gradually and resolutely approach Christian perfection.

Obviously the CC reserves the right entirely for itself to define what is "just" and what is "unjust" discrimination. Rolling Eyes

Sorry, but if the Catholic Church cannot see eye-poppingly obvious discrimination in its catechism as quoted above, then it has literally zero self-awareness. No wonder it's so rapidly losing its last vestiges of relevance.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 6:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, can't really disagree. The social virtue signalling is all very well, but if the underlying structures don't change / update...

--A
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

+JMJ+

Intra-Thread Trackbacks: pg 17 / pg 18 / pg 18


Are L.G.B.T. employees at Catholic institutions protected by the new SCOTUS ruling? [In-Depth, Analysis]

Quote:

Activists and supporters block the street outside the U.S. Supreme Court in Washington Oct. 8, 2019, as it hears arguments in three major employment discrimination cases on whether federal civil rights law prohibiting workplace discrimination on the "basis of sex" covers gay and transgender employees. (CNS photo/Jonathan Ernst, Reuters)


People working at faith-based organizations who have been fired because of their gender identity or sexual orientation will be able to sue their employers, the Supreme Court of the United States ruled on June 15, marking a major milestone for L.G.B.T. rights in the United States. In his majority opinion on the case, Bostock v. Clayton County, Justice Neil M. Gorsuch wrote, "An employer who fires an individual for being homosexual or transgender fires that person for traits or actions it would not have questioned in members of a different sex." As a result, the employer violated Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which, according to the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, "prohibits employment discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex and national origin."

But for L.G.B.T. people working for Catholic institutions, legal experts say, it is too soon to tell if the ruling will offer any new protection.

How does the court's ruling affect L.G.B.T. employees at Catholic institutions?

The simple answer is that it is unlikely the ruling will protect many L.G.B.T. employees at many Catholic institutions.

Why?

For a few reasons, but primarily because of something called the "ministerial exception," which recognizes the right of churches and other religious communities to choose their own clergy and others who work in ministry-related fields.

[...]

In addition to ministerial exception, religious organizations are granted additional protections, including constitutional rights around religious liberty, as well as rights concerning the freedom of speech and association. But the exemptions from Title VII are not absolute.

Kimberly West-Faulcon, a professor of constitutional law at Loyola Marymount University in Los Angeles, said that other characteristics protected by federal law are not supplanted by the religious organization exception.

"A Catholic school cannot say, 'I'm not going to hire you as a teacher because hiring an African American person is contrary to the tenets of our religion,'" Professor West-Faulcon said. "That is not a permissible religious organization exception to Title VII. The question going forward is whether the previously very limited ministerial exception will become an exception that swallows the rule."

What about employees who aren't ministers or who don't teach religion?

This is where things become a bit more complicated.

[...]

As for how Monday's decision truly affects L.G.B.T. employees working for Catholic organizations, greater insight likely will not come until the court decides the ministerial exception cases. But all the lawyers interviewed by America said they believed one thing is certain: more lawsuits regarding religious employers and sexual orientation and gender identity are in store.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apparently LBGT folks cannot read the Constitution or various Federal Laws--they already have equal civil rights. We refer to that as "the Fourteenth Amendment".
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Then how come you needed separate laws to allow them to marry? Very Happy

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

🤔
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Avatar wrote:
Then how come you needed separate laws to allow them to marry? Very Happy

--A


Because people are stupid, that's why. I can solve any problem except "people being stupid", and there are a lot more of them than there are of me.

Technically, we did not need such a law, since each State must honor the documents from any other State, which is why we don't have to carry a driver's license for every State we may visit. A marriage license from Illinois is valid in Texas and a concealed carry license from Texas should be valid in California--should be, but isn't.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds almost like the states don't always adhere to constitutional values in their legislation. Wink

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another Day One EO has Biden ordering public schools to allow MTF to compete in girls' athletics. If you have daughters who are in sports now, get them out while you can--those males who can't compete against other males are now going to transition so they can compete against females and win. Recall that I looked up the numbers once--mediocre/middle-of-the-pack males in track still beat Florence Joyner's world records by at least 0.5 seconds.

How many male athletes are also going to "transition" just so they can hit the showers after practice?

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2021 7:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

None I'm pretty sure.

I also highly doubt that you would be able to simply declare yourself trans and immediately be on a women's team and have access to such facilities. Prurience however seems never to go out of fashion...

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2021 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Avatar wrote:
None I'm pretty sure.

I also highly doubt that you would be able to simply declare yourself trans and immediately be on a women's team and have access to such facilities. Prurience however seems never to go out of fashion...
You'd be wrong. All one has to do is to declare that they're trans. Anyone who demanded proof, or counseling, or some sort of "test" would be sued off the face of the Earth and cancelled immediately.

Anti-science is a religion.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2021 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Democrats only believe in science that fits their narrative.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 12:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Obi-Wan Nihilo wrote:
Avatar wrote:
I also highly doubt that you would be able to simply declare yourself trans and immediately be on a women's team and have access to such facilities. Prurience however seems never to go out of fashion...
You'd be wrong. All one has to do is to declare that they're trans. Anyone who demanded proof, or counseling, or some sort of "test" would be sued off the face of the Earth and cancelled immediately.

Anti-science is a religion.


Exactly. At this time in the United States all one needs to do is publicly declare one's gender and that settles the matter--the school would not be allowed, by law, to question that person's decision and would have to treat them as the gender they are claiming to be, even if no medications towards actual transitioning are being taken.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 11:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A failed NBA player should test this. Declare for the WNBA.
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 24, 2021 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If I'm outside the ladies room waiting for my wife or daughter, and somebody who nobody would ever suspect self-identifies as a woman tries to go in I am not forbidden to question said person. If I'm told "I self-identify as a woman, so I'm using this room.", I can say, "What a coincidence - so do I." And go in with said person. I can't be questioned by those in charge any more than the other person can be.
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 24, 2021 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry, Fist. I agree with your chivalrous impulse, but the Roger Rabbit "only when it's funny..." temptation is just too strong.

To the tune of 'G-d Rest Ye Merry Gentlemen', Bob Rivers wrote:
The restroom door said gentleman so I just walked inside,
I took two steps and realized I've been taken for a ride.
I heard high voices, turned and found the place was occupied,
By two nuns, three old ladies and a nurse.
What could be worse?
Than two nuns, three old ladies and a nurse.

The restroom door said gentleman it must have been a gag,
As soon as I walked in there I ran into some old hag.
She sprayed me with a can of mace and smacked me with her bag,
I could tell, this just wouldn't be my day.
What can I say?
It just wasn't turning out to be my day.

The restroom door said gentleman and I would like to find,
The crummy little creep who had the nerve to switch the signs.
'Cause I got two black eyes and one high heel up my behind,
Now I can't, sit with comfort and joy.
Boy oh boy.
Now I'll never sit with comfort and joy.

We're beyond "Don't look, Ethel..." While I'm not saying the womenfolk are on their own, maybe we can serve them better by not preemptively charging to the rescue...not that you were suggesting such. They are not powerless, nor are they without judgement.

I'd prefer to believe that the rightful occupants ought to feel free to respond as they determine to be appropriate. Chips will fall as they may.
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