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Israeli politics
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Heh...Bibi's flipped back to 2-state side. [he's actually trying to say he never said he wouldn't let it happen, or if he did that's not what he meant.]
I thought he might---but seriously? Didn't even take him 3 days!?

Anyway, interesting graphic at showing party coalition before, and possible/predicted now.
It illustrates one thing I mentioned [that Likud pulled pretty much all its gains from other right-parties that would ally with him anyway].

It shows something else: Kulanu party. NYT gives them to Bibi's side.
But, from what I've seen...which isn't a lot, but some...Kulanu doesn't like Netenyahu personally, and has some Left positions.
So...Netenayahu could, theoretically, still lose his position.
And that...specifically because of Kulanu...might be why he's dancing so fast.


www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/03/19/world/middleeast/netanyahu-likud-election-knesset-coalition.html
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 20, 2015 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hard-line positions don't play well any more, at least not like they used to.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 01, 2015 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Palestinian Authority is now a member of the International Criminal Court.

Quote:


Palestine has officially become a member of the International Criminal Court. The Palestinian Authority joined the ICC earlier this year after the United States and Israel successfully lobbied against a U.N. Security Council measure calling for an end to the Israeli occupation and the establishment of a Palestinian state by 2017. Palestinian negotiator Saeb Erekat said the court has already opened a preliminary inquiry into possible war crimes committed by Israel in the Occupied Territories.

Saeb Erekat: "The court has already begun preliminary examination and we hope that those who are trying to pressure Palestine not to make referral to the court, we are the victims, they should go to the criminals and ask them to stop committing crimes. Settlement activities, dictations, demolition of homes, the continuation of occupation are all war crimes and Israel will be held accountable."

Israel had retaliated against the ICC bid by withholding hundreds of millions in Palestinian tax revenue needed to pay salaries and provide public services. But it recently released the money in a bid to ease tensions with the United States and avert the Palestinian Authority’s collapse.


Investigating Israel for war crimes isn't going to make them suddenly have a change of heart and embrace their Palestinian brothers in a group hug. On the contrary, some lawmakers in the Knesset are going to become more hard-line than they might otherwise have been, especially if the ICC starts trying to force Israel to cough up money or put individuals on trial.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 6:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, agreed. Not that I think their inclusion is a bad thing, but they're using it wrong. The problem is always that the people in power appear more invested in prolonging conflict than ending it.

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PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2015 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I didn't see any other thread into which to place this and it will directly impact Israeli politics so this is a good place to link this story.

The Vatican will officially recognize the State of Palestine.


Quote:
The Vatican will officially recognize the state of Palestine in a new treaty. The treaty concerns the Vatican’s interests in the Occupied Territories. Earlier drafts referred to the "Palestine Liberation Organization" rather than the "State of Palestine," but the Vatican has referred to the state of Palestine in other contexts since at least 2012, when the United Nations voted to recognize Palestine as a non-member observer state.


My own personal view is that there is no such thing as a State of Palestine but I can't tell the Vatican whom they may or may not recognize. That being said, this will give a little more legitimacy to that quasi-entity and will put pressure on Israel itself. I wonder how they are going to respond?
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PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2015 4:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't really expect any response from them. In favour of a two-state solution, so good thing in my opinion.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 22, 2015 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A recent UN study concludes that [url=america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/6/22/un-both-sides-may-have-committed-war-crimes-in-gaza.html]both sides, Israel and Palestine, most likely committed war crimes during last year's hostilities[/url].

There will never be a "two State solution". Eventually, one side will so completely wipe out the other that the losing side will not be able to recover. At this time, the "winning" side--if I wanted to be more accurate I would use the phrase "non-losing" rather than "winning"--would be Israel, since they have more guns.

Incidentally, there was a recent Supreme Court decision that allowed the State Department and the President to continue to issue "Israel" rather than "Jerusalem" on passports for United States citizens born in Israel (or whatever quasi-dual-citizenship status various Israeli-Americans have). The Court basically said that the President gets to recognize countries so what happens if a future Republican President decides to officially recognize Jersualem as the capital of Israel? I am merely curious.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 2015 5:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hashi Lebwohl wrote:
Eventually, one side will so completely wipe out the other that the losing side will not be able to recover.


Thereby sowing the seeds of yet more future discord, oppression, hate and resistance.

As for the UN study, seems pretty likely to me...

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Netanyahu wrote:
The report in hand was commissioned by a notoriously biased institution. . . The United Nations Human Rights Council has a singular obsession with Israel. It has passed more resolutions against Israel than against Syria, North Korea and Iran combined. In fact, it has passed more resolutions against Israel that against all the countries of the world combined.
So, is he right?
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2015 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The UN really does dislike both Israel and the United States but as a body it cannot afford to upset either country because a majority of its funding still comes from the United States. It is for this reason that I have long argued that we should stop sending any money to the UN. Why give money to an organization that dislikes us?

That doesn't mean that Israel didn't go over the top in its response to last year's attack because they did.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2015 5:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Meh...almost every (if not every) resolution against Israel has been vetoed by, you guessed it, the United States.

They're more like a motion of censure than anything meaningful.

Everybody thinks the UN is a great idea, as long as they only act against other countries. Nobody wants to let them act when its against national interests. So there are very few things they can ever actually do.

The UN is a joke because it has no power. Because the people who started it wouldn't ever allow it any. Until it has the power to back itself it is barely more than a body of global opinion.

That's not it's fault.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An interesting policy change, if a little over the top.

Quote:
In news from Israel, the Security Cabinet has approved a policy of detention without trial for citizens who are suspected of attacks against Palestinians. The move comes after Jewish settlers firebombed a Palestinian home in the West Bank Friday, killing an 18-month-old baby. Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas has called the arson attack a "war crime" and has vowed to bring it to the International Criminal Court.


If you have a citizen who is suspected of attacking Palestinians then why not arrest them, charge them, try them, and put them in jail if they are found guilty? Perhaps the Security Cabinet is trying to go "above and beyond the call of duty" to show that it is trying to crack down on attacks on Palestinians.

Mr. Abbas is incorrect in his assessment, though. The firebombing isn't a "war crime"--the settlers aren't military personnel--but it could be considered an act of terrorism.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hashi Lebwohl wrote:
An interesting policy change, if a little over the top.

Quote:
In news from Israel, the Security Cabinet has approved a policy of detention without trial for citizens who are suspected of attacks against Palestinians. The move comes after Jewish settlers firebombed a Palestinian home in the West Bank Friday, killing an 18-month-old baby. Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas has called the arson attack a "war crime" and has vowed to bring it to the International Criminal Court.


If you have a citizen who is suspected of attacking Palestinians then why not arrest them, charge them, try them, and put them in jail if they are found guilty? Perhaps the Security Cabinet is trying to go "above and beyond the call of duty" to show that it is trying to crack down on attacks on Palestinians.

Mr. Abbas is incorrect in his assessment, though. The firebombing isn't a "war crime"--the settlers aren't military personnel--but it could be considered an act of terrorism.


That is interesting, and I agree with you, it would be an act of terrorism. The only responsibility from the State would be if they indirectly support it by not acknowledging/doing something about it. This policy seems to address that specifically.

What is interesting is that if you detain these subjects out of the legal system, you are not only detaining them indefinitely, but you could potentially free them at any time or even use them in their military. History strongly supports that they'd be detained indefinitely, but with this tension between Israel and Palestine, keeping potential fighters "in reserve" might be an attractive option for both sides.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agreed. Good to see they're taking a stand against it, but I can't support detention without trial.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Avatar wrote:
Agreed. Good to see they're taking a stand against it, but I can't support detention without trial.

--A


Yea, agreed.
I wonder though [and I don't know enough about the function and tendencies of trials and juries in Israeli justice] if maybe they're taking the step because the people wouldn't be found guilty by a jury of their peers?
Doesn't mean detaining them that way is right...but makes it comprehensible.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 05, 2015 5:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

According to Wiki:

Quote:
The legal basis for Israel's use of Administrative Detention is the British Mandate 1945 Defence (Emergency) Regulations which were amended in 1979 to form the Israeli Law on Authority in States of Emergency. Administrative detention is often used for indefinite detention of Palestinian political prisoners.[20] It seems to be mainly used by Israel against individuals not engaged in violent activities.[21] Administrative detention is also used in cases where the available evidence consists of information obtained by the security services (particularly the Shin Bet), and where a trial would reveal sensitive security information, such as the identities of informers or infiltrators.

Although it is commonly applied to alleged Palestinian militants, it has occasionally been applied to Jewish Israeli citizens, including Jewish right-wing public-figures and activists (e.g. in the aftermath of the assassination of Yitzhak Rabin) and in more recent years sometimes to settlers for short periods.[22]

Within Israel, the Defense Minister has the authority to issue Administrative Detention orders for up to 6 months in cases where there is a reasonable chance that the person harms the security of the state. The same Minister has the authority to renew such orders. Likewise, the Chief of the General Staff can issue such orders, but valid for only 48 hours. Law enforcement authorities have to show cause within 48 hours (in a hearing behind closed doors). Administrative Detention orders can be appealed to the District Court and, if denied there, to the Supreme Court of Israel. The District Court can annul such orders if it finds the administrative detention occurred for reasons other than security (e.g., common crimes, or the exercise of freedom of expression). Overall supervisory authority on the application of the relevant law rests with the Minister of Justice.

Within the West Bank and Gaza Strip, any Israeli district army commander can issue an administrative detention order, and the order can be appealed at the Israeli district military court, or, if denied there, at the Supreme Court. Here too, an administrative detention order is valid for at most six months, but can be renewed by the appropriate authority. Israel refers its use of administrative detention in the occupied territories to Article 78 of the Fourth Geneva Convention 1949, which states that "If the Occupying Power considers it necessary, for imperative reasons of security, to take safety measures concerning protected persons, it may, at the most, subject them to assigned residence or to internment."[23]


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They fire-bombed an 18-month-old child. I doubt that even a jury of peers would find them "not guilty".
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 4:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's not why they detain people without trial. It's because usually such detention is not as a result of anything for which they could be tried. They haven't actually committed a crime.

The people who fire-bombed the child are not being detained without trial, they committed a crime and would be arrested. Israel has just extended their detention without trial program to include Israeli's now.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2015 6:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No idea whether this will make any difference...his essential position hasn't changed. (Not that I necessarily think it should actually.)

Quote:
Netanyahu ready for peace talks with Abbas 'now'

Jerusalem - Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu said on Tuesday he was willing to engage in immediate and direct peace talks with Palestinian President Mahmud Abbas, without preconditions.

"I am ready now to go to Ramallah or any other place in order to meet and hold direct negotiations," Netanyahu told members of Women Wage Peace, established following last summer's war between Israel and Hamas in the Gaza Strip.

"I have no preconditions for negotiations," he said in remarks relayed by his office.

Yet he said, reiterating his longstanding position: "The solution is two states for two peoples - a demilitarised Palestinian state that recognises the national state of the Jewish people."


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[url=apnews.myway.com/article/20151004/ml--israel-palestinians-0862db682d.html]This is not going to improve the situation[/url] any time soon.

Quote:
JERUSALEM (AP) — In an unprecedented measure, Israeli police barred Palestinians from Jerusalem's Old City on Sunday in response to stabbing attacks that killed two Israelis and wounded three others, as Israel's prime minister vowed a "harsh offensive" to counter rising violence.

Tensions have flared in recent weeks over an Old City holy site sacred to Muslims and Jews, a series of so-called "lone wolf" attacks on Israelis and a security clampdown, which on Sunday saw Israeli troops launch a bloody arrest raid in the West Bank.

The latest spike in violence comes at a time when many Palestinians no longer believe statehood through negotiations with Israel is possible. Israeli commentators raised the possibility of a third uprising, though Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas has so far prevented major outbreaks of violence despite his growing friction with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu.

In response to the recent violence, Israeli police said they would prevent Palestinian residents of Jerusalem from entering the Old City for two days during a Jewish holiday. Palestinians who live, work and study within the Old City, as well as Israelis and tourists, will be allowed in.

*************

Tensions have soared in recent weeks over a major holy site known to Jews as the Temple Mount and to Muslims as the Noble Sanctuary, the site of the Al-Aqsa Mosque. Israeli police and Palestinian demonstrators have clashed repeatedly there in recent weeks.

The unrest has spread to the West Bank, where at least 18 Palestinians were wounded in clashes with Israeli troops Sunday during an Israeli arrest raid. On Friday, an Israeli couple was killed in a Palestinian drive-by shooting in the West Bank.

Netanyahu said he would meet with security officials Sunday to decide on a "harsh offensive on Palestinian Islamic terror," according to a statement on his Facebook page. "We are in an all-out war against terror," Netanyahu wrote.

Israel's leading newspaper commentator, Nahum Barnea, called the recent violence the "Third Intifada," referring to Palestinian uprisings in the 1980s and the early 2000s. "Not calling it by name allows the political and military establishment to evade, repress, shirk responsibility," he wrote in the Yediot Ahronot newspaper.

But Hani al-Masri, a Palestinian political analyst, said it was not likely the start of a new Intifada. "Intifada needs a leadership and the Palestinian political leadership is against it," he said.

Relatives of the teen behind Sunday's attack identified him as Fadi Alloun, 19, from traditionally Arab east Jerusalem. On Saturday, he wrote on his Facebook page: "Either martyrdom or victory."

Muhannad Halabi, the 19-year-old Palestinian behind the deadly stabbing attack on Saturday, also wrote a post on Facebook before the attack: "What's happening to our holy places? What's happening to our mothers and sisters in the Al-Aqsa mosque? We are not the people who accept humiliation. Our people will revolt."


Here is what will happen: a few more attacks in the Old City, a few more people will be seriously injured or killed on their way to pray, and the military will close Old City completely, even to Palestinians who may work there. Things will degenerate even more quickly after that. Notice in the article that many Palestinians have given up hope that negotiations with Israel will lead to anything; once they give up on diplomacy there is only one tactic left--fight.
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