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Israeli politics
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 2:06 pm    Post subject: Israeli politics Reply with quote

[url=en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Likud]Likud[/url] seems to have [url=news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4282234.stm]cut off its nose to spite its face[/url].

Last edited by [Syl] on Mon Oct 24, 2005 1:19 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 2:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeowch! Why the Hell would they do that?
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess that's the problem with uniting different parties to gain power. Eventually, you're going to have internal disagreement, and in this case, it might have disabled the whole party.
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I guess. Still, it's one of those things that's never a good idea (cutting your man's mic cord).
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

:::shaking head:::

Isreali politics is beyond me.
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Likud has in fact silenced themselves. the NeoCons should heed this. debate is only good. if the other party/parts of your party don't have good points, put that out there. and if they have good points, address them.
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Israeli politics are very complex.

I've always been intrigued by this sort of inter-party alliances etc. that I'll probably never see in American politics because of the two-party system. That's one of the reasons international politics interest me a lot.
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I heard on NPR that Sharon would possibly be starting a centrist party that would draw people from both sides and (ideally, I suppose) weaken both the right and the left. And really, with friends like that, who needs enemies, right? I suppose it will all depend on who wins.

www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4864033 (Click "Listen" and select your file type)
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks like Hamas was so happy to have Israel withdraw from Gaza they launched dozens of rocket attack into Israel. <shakes head>

At what point will the international community realize that there is only one side in the conflict that wants mutual peace.
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2005 11:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very true, Brinn.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas

What else is there to say?
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 12:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Brinn wrote:
Looks like Hamas was so happy to have Israel withdraw from Gaza they launched dozens of rocket attack into Israel. <shakes head>

At what point will the international community realize that there is only one side in the conflict that wants mutual peace.


When they finally do manage to destroy Israel? Rolling Eyes
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 12:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know, the Likud thing seems like typical political antics to me. Politcians in Israel are an unruly bunch. Razz
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 4:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

when will the USA stop demanding that the tracts of the road to peace be greased with Jewish blood?
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 5:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think that they'll ever manage to destroy Israel, but I do think that Brinn makes a good point too.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 5:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sgtnull wrote:
when will the USA stop demanding that the tracts of the road to peace be greased with Jewish blood?
What exactly does this mean?
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2005 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

how many times has the US criticized Israel for protecting itself? when they blew up reactors did the US side with them or sign onto the UN resolution? did the US call for borders based on nice numbers and not on the reality of the Palestinian Liberation Org? have we not been calling for some insane peace process when it states in the PLO charter that Israel needs to be destroyed? have we not put oil interests before the interest of the only Middle Eastern democracy? that's what it means.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2005 2:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does Israel have a majority population that is not allowed to vote? Does Israel fire rockets into apartment buildings to retaliate against suicide bombers? Has not the US vetoed every UN resolution on Human Rights that would've affected Israel? Is the PLO in charge of anything, really? How much semetic blood did Israel "spend" in order to make iullegal and unsanctioned land grabs since the beginning of their country? How much has the US unquestioning support of Israeli policies cost them on the world arena?
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2005 4:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Plissken wrote:
Does Israel have a majority population that is not allowed to vote?


Just what are you talking about, Plissken?
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2005 5:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Plissken: what land grabs? you mean the territories aquirred when attacked by various Muslim states? if the Muslim countries in question cared so much for the Palestinians, why not give them land? why not negotiate for such, as when Egypt settled with Israel? and who should the US be supporting, the democracy or the theocracies? or should we let the PLO wipe the earth clean of Jews as is their stated goal? i don't believe that Israel put genocide of the Palestinians in their charter, did they? and Israel has not kept up a decades long reign of terror. not too many Jews flying planes into buildings, blowing up buses and discos by suicide bomber. was that Israel slaughtering athletes at the Olympic games? was Israel hijacking Muslim planes or boats, and shooting hostages?

i'm sorry Plissken, i forgot the question...
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All the questions are confusing me, to be honest.

Israel withdraws from Gaza, right?
Hamas attacks Israel from Gaza right?
Israel retaliates, as promised, right?

All looking good so far.
Then:

After retaliation, Hamas declares cease-fire, promises no more attacks.
Israel continues to strike Gaza, claiming that despite cease-fire, Hamas was still secretly inciting attacks[/i]
Hamas kills Israeli in retaliation.

What's with that? Despite their beliefs/assumptions/fears/(knowledge?), of Hamas' activities, continuing strikes after the cease-fire cost them a moral highground, I think. On the whole, I've always had a fair amount of respect for Israel as a nation, but I think this was a mistake.

Even if, as I wondered, they did pull out of Gaza to give them a justification when the attacks didn't end, (as they must have suspected), it remained acceptable to retaliate, even massively to continuing attacks.

To maintain that though, the cease-fire should have stopped the attacks as well. The instant the cease-fire failed, (as it would if those fears are true), start retaliating again. Now though, they look agressive and unreasonable.

Just thoughts...Syl? I know you pretty much keep up with all this. What's your thoughts?

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